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blakes7-d Digest Volume 00 : Issue 235
Today's Topics:
Re: [B7L] Liberator space travel [ Betty Ragan <ragan@sdc.org> ]
Java Applets [ applet_graphics@123india.com ]
Re: [B7L] Java Applets [ Calle Dybedahl <calle@lysator.liu.s ]
[B7L] Re:Liberator space travel [ Helen Krummenacker <avona@jps.net> ]
[B7L] Why Not Blake II? [ "Dana Shilling" <dshilling@worldnet ]
Re: [B7L] Liberator space travel [ "J MacQueen" <j_macqueen@hotmail.co ]
Re: [B7L] FC: New frame captures [ "J MacQueen" <j_macqueen@hotmail.co ]
[B7L] Movie question [ "Gareth Randall" <gareth_randall@ho ]
Re: [B7L] Liberator space travel [ "Sally Manton" <smanton@hotmail.com ]
[B7L] Why Not Blake II? [ "Sally Manton" <smanton@hotmail.com ]
Re: [B7L] Why Not Blake II? [ Iain Coleman <ijc@bas.ac.uk> ]
Re: [B7L] Why Not Blake II? [ "Jeroen J. Kwast" <jeroenkw@gns.get ]
Re: [B7L] Re:Liberator space travel [ "Christine+Steve" <cgorman@idirect. ]
Re: [B7L] Re:Liberator space travel [ Iain Coleman <ijc@bas.ac.uk> ]
Re: [B7L] Why Not Blake II? [ "Marian de Haan" <maya@multiweb.nl> ]
Re: [B7L] Why Not Blake II? [ Betty Ragan <ragan@sdc.org> ]
The Jacket (was Re: [B7L] FC: New fr [ mistral@ptinet.net ]
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 20 Aug 2000 09:22:29 -0600
From: Betty Ragan <ragan@sdc.org>
To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: Re: [B7L] Liberator space travel
Message-ID: <399FF7B5.C4914FBB@sdc.org>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
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Christine+Steve wrote:
> I was watching Duel the other day and noticed this at the start :
>
> TRAVIS: Blake. The other patrols have pushed him into this galaxy. I knew
> it, I knew it! This time I've got him.
>
> I was wondering if this was a slip, or does this mean the Liberator
> routinely travels between different galaxies?
*Definitely* a slip. (This is one piece of poor terminology that
really, *really* puts my teeth on edge. It displays such a basic
ignorance of the universe, and it's *so* easily prevented, and yet it's
very, very common in media SF.) It certainly doesn't gel with "Star
One." Either Travis misspoke, or Travis is completely clueless, or this
is some new definition of the word "galaxy" with which we were not
previously familiar.
On a sort-of unrelated note, my all-time favorite astronomical
terminology gaffe in B7 is "Cynus X-L" for what was surely supposed to
be "Cygnus X-1" (a real astronomical object). Obviously, somebody got
confused by the typography!
--
Betty Ragan ** ragan@sdc.org ** http://www.sdc.org/~ragan/
"Imposing Latin rules on English structure is a little
like trying to play baseball in ice skates." -- Bill Bryson
------------------------------
Date: 20 Aug 2000 08:49:54 -0700
From: applet_graphics@123india.com
To: blakes7-d@lysator.liu.se
Subject: Java Applets
Message-ID: <20000820154954.6816.cpmta@c008.sfo.cp.net>
Content-Type: text/plain
Content-Disposition: inline
Hello,
A request for all of you to visit the site www.geocities.com/applet_graphics.
You can use all the source code there for free!!!!
Also visit the exquisite rose flower animation
to present your loved ones. The rose flower animation is available at www.geocities.com/applet_graphics/RoseExtreme/ExtremeRose.html
Regards
Applet_graphics team
______________________________________________________
123India.com - India's Premier Portal
Get your Free Email Account at http://www.123india.com
------------------------------
Date: 20 Aug 2000 18:27:59 +0200
From: Calle Dybedahl <calle@lysator.liu.se>
To: applet_graphics@123india.com
Cc: blakes7-d@lysator.liu.se
Subject: Re: [B7L] Java Applets
Message-ID: <86itsvdhio.fsf@tezcatlipoca.algonet.se>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
>>>>> "applet" == applet graphics <applet_graphics@123india.com> writes:
This user has been removed from the list and reported to the relevant
abuse departments.
--
Calle Dybedahl, Vasav. 82, S-177 52 Jaerfaella,SWEDEN | calle@lysator.liu.se
"Just about anything can be done if you are demented enough."
-- Christopher C. Petro, scary.devil.monastery
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 20 Aug 2000 11:53:56 -0700
From: Helen Krummenacker <avona@jps.net>
To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: [B7L] Re:Liberator space travel
Message-ID: <39A02944.26C@jps.net>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
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> I was wondering if this was a slip, or does this mean the Liberator
> routinely travels between different galaxies? I don't see this gelling with
> Star One - when the do leave the galaxy. I suspect Travis should have said
> "pushed him into this system", or something like that. Any ideas?
>
>
> Steve Dobson
Ah... to interpret this playing the game, rather than rolling our eyes
at a continuity error, I would suggest that this is evidence that FTL
occurs by dimensional shift, and Travis is referring to the Liberator
being forced back into normal space, thus being 'within the galaxy',
which exists within 3 spatial dimensions but is 'flat' in hyperspace,
allowing ships to go 'outside' it to take shortcuts. Does that work for
you?
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 20 Aug 2000 18:08:27 -0400
From: "Dana Shilling" <dshilling@worldnet.att.net>
To: "b7" <blakes7@lysator.liu.se>
Subject: [B7L] Why Not Blake II?
Message-ID: <001c01c00af3$646bf020$83694e0c@dshilling>
Content-Type: text/plain;
charset="iso-8859-1"
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If I were in charge of a series called Blakes7, and I
had just found out that Blake had handed in his
notice, I don't think I would have just nodded and
said, OK, right, we have absolutely no Blake of any
kind.
Why not film a few episodes of The Quest for Blake
(to give Gareth Thomas a chance to change his mind),
then FIND him, in the person of another actor ("Yes,
well, I had a good deal of plastic surgery to fool
the Federation, even in its fragmented state" or
"That life capsule didn't half prang")? A three-man
interplanetary testosterone assay would have been
fun to watch.
Of course, my first choice for Blake II would be
Stephen Greif, especially if they brought back
Brian Croucher as Travis II ("there was a safety
net underneath Star One" makes at least as much
sense as "teleport malfunction" as an explanation of
Servalan's survival after Terminal). And they could
do the Marx Brothers mirror routine when they
were chasing each other.
-(Y)
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 21 Aug 2000 08:40:59 EST
From: "J MacQueen" <j_macqueen@hotmail.com>
To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: Re: [B7L] Liberator space travel
Message-ID: <F179tHbLUnR2A2gR7sY000057e6@hotmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed
>From: Betty Ragan <ragan@sdc.org>
>On a sort-of unrelated note, my all-time favorite astronomical
>terminology gaffe in B7 is "Cynus X-L" for what was surely supposed to
>be "Cygnus X-1" (a real astronomical object). Obviously, somebody got
>confused by the typography!
They certainly would have if they'd been reading late '70s vintage New
Scientists. Some library copies certainly confused me! Actually, I like the
suggestion I read some time ago that Avon was influenced by the spreadsheet
programme he'd been using for his embezzlement attempt.
Regards
Joanne
________________________________________________________________________
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------------------------------
Date: Mon, 21 Aug 2000 08:42:52 EST
From: "J MacQueen" <j_macqueen@hotmail.com>
To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: Re: [B7L] FC: New frame captures
Message-ID: <F197WDsUIkOZBQhmpAR00005ca0@hotmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed
>From: mistral@ptinet.net
>Thank you, Lisa. Next to white coveralls, I do believe I like
>brown vinyl the best ;-)
<winks back> With matador jackets close behind, I believe...
Regards
Joanne
________________________________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 20 Aug 2000 23:44:05 BST
From: "Gareth Randall" <gareth_randall@hotmail.com>
To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: [B7L] Movie question
Message-ID: <LAW2-F211TrpwACkWHZ0000481a@hotmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed
Hi all,
Some of the longer-standing list members may recognise my name - I was a
member aeons ago!
I've popped back in because I figured that if anyone knows the status of the
TV movie, they'd be on the list. Things seem to have been awfully quiet on
that particular front for well over a year... would I be correct in the
assumption that Darrow and Lighthill are still trying to get the funding in
place?
If this is something that has been done to death on the list (and
consequently, everyone is sick of it), then I apologise for bringing it up
again, but if someone could drop me a private mail to fill me in, I'd be
extremely grateful!
Cheers,
Gareth
________________________________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 21 Aug 2000 08:13:26 GMT
From: "Sally Manton" <smanton@hotmail.com>
To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: Re: [B7L] Liberator space travel
Message-ID: <LAW-F82paNJ5mbFTz31000012d6@hotmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed
Steve wrote:
< I was wondering if this was a slip, or does this mean the Liberator
routinely travels between different galaxies?>
In the absence of a sensible explanation, I'll assume that Travis
was woken up from his favourite Flash Gordon dream (he gets to be
Ming the Merciless instead of Servalan, and Flash - who's
developed suspiciously curly hair BTW - gets eaten nice and slowly by
Venusian tree people) and takes a few minutes to bring his brain
into gear, poor - errrr - dear.
________________________________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 21 Aug 2000 08:15:41 GMT
From: "Sally Manton" <smanton@hotmail.com>
To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: [B7L] Why Not Blake II?
Message-ID: <LAW-F13095HFJ6E8WY800003b3f@hotmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed
Dana wrote:
<Why not film a few episodes of The Quest for Blake (to give Gareth
Thomas a chance to change his mind), then FIND him, in the person of
another actor ("Yes, well, I had a good deal of plastic surgery to
fool the Federation, even in its fragmented state" or "That life
capsule didn't half prang")?>
SOMEONE ELSE playing Blake?!?!?! Bite thy tongue!!! <mutter grumble>
next thing, someone will be suggesting a non-PD Avon ...
Seriously, I'd never accept a B7 episode with either of them recast,
unregenerate character junkie that I am (or with Vila recast, for that
matter). While there's a lot of other things I like (and a lot of the
characters that I like as well), central to my love or the show is
Blake, Avon and the complicated relationship between them, and the
wonderful chemistry between Gareth and Paul was crucial to that
appeal. It just wouldn't be a tenth as interesting without that (even
Avon and Vila - and the chemistry between those actors - just isn't as
good).
(Not that I'm biased or tunnel-visioned or anything, as you've all noticed).
From what I've read, the producer knew that Gareth was *not* going
to change his mind, and considered him irreplaceable in the role (a
decision you surely don't expect *me* to disagree with :-)).
And it wouldn't have been a three-way battle, because had Blake not left,
they probably wouldn't have bothered coming up with one Captain Del
Tarrant anyway ...
________________________________________________________________________
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------------------------------
Date: Mon, 21 Aug 2000 10:29:54 +0100 (BST)
From: Iain Coleman <ijc@bas.ac.uk>
To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: Re: [B7L] Why Not Blake II?
Message-Id: <Pine.OSF.3.96.1000821102228.1546A-100000@bsauasc>
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
On Mon, 21 Aug 2000, Sally Manton wrote:
> Dana wrote:
> <Why not film a few episodes of The Quest for Blake (to give Gareth
> Thomas a chance to change his mind), then FIND him, in the person of
> another actor ("Yes, well, I had a good deal of plastic surgery to
> fool the Federation, even in its fragmented state" or "That life
> capsule didn't half prang")?>
>
> SOMEONE ELSE playing Blake?!?!?! Bite thy tongue!!! <mutter grumble>
> next thing, someone will be suggesting a non-PD Avon ...
While I'm generally comfortable with heresy, I have to agree that
recasting Blake would be very iffy indeed. The reason? Of all the main
characters, Blake is the most difficult to cast. It's easy to think of
other actors who could play Vila, Cally, Jenna and so on -- and Avon is an
actor-proof role if ever I saw one -- but I find it very, very difficult
to imagine anyone else as Blake. It's a complex role, demanding a blend of
passion, heroism, ruthlessness, insecurity and danger that just wouldn't
work if you didn't have exactly the right actor for the job.
Avon, like Dr Who or Iago, could be played by anyone with an Equity card
and a pulse. Blake isn't that kind of role.
Iain
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 21 Aug 100 12:05:55 +0200 (CEST)
From: "Jeroen J. Kwast" <jeroenkw@gns.getronics.nl>
To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: Re: [B7L] Why Not Blake II?
Message-Id: <200008211005.e7LA5t606829@pampus.gns.getronics.nl>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Hello!
>
> Dana wrote:
> <Why not film a few episodes of The Quest for Blake (to give Gareth
> Thomas a chance to change his mind), then FIND him, in the person of
> another actor ("Yes, well, I had a good deal of plastic surgery to
> fool the Federation, even in its fragmented state" or "That life
> capsule didn't half prang")?>
>
> SOMEONE ELSE playing Blake?!?!?! Bite thy tongue!!! <mutter grumble>
> next thing, someone will be suggesting a non-PD Avon ...
>
What is wrong with another blake? I would love to see BlakeII on the screen today.
Don't expect those old folk willing to appear again. I'm tempted to think you
dont care about the show as much as the characters! :)
> Seriously, I'd never accept a B7 episode with either of them recast,
> unregenerate character junkie that I am (or with Vila recast, for that
> matter). While there's a lot of other things I like (and a lot of the
> characters that I like as well), central to my love or the show is
> Blake, Avon and the complicated relationship between them, and the
> wonderful chemistry between Gareth and Paul was crucial to that
> appeal. It just wouldn't be a tenth as interesting without that (even
> Avon and Vila - and the chemistry between those actors - just isn't as
> good).
>
You call that seriously????? So you want me to believe that you rather have
NOTHING than a brand new series bases on the original series with new characters?
You don't think that it is even remotely possible that those new characters can
have some chemistry going too???
> (Not that I'm biased or tunnel-visioned or anything, as you've all noticed).
Not at all! I for one want to see a 2000 version of B7 because I LOVED the
show. I like everything about it including the characters and the wobbeling.
Lose 1 or 2 aspects -> doesn't mean the whole show.
>
> >From what I've read, the producer knew that Gareth was *not* going
> to change his mind, and considered him irreplaceable in the role (a
> decision you surely don't expect *me* to disagree with :-)).
>
I do. :) I really like blake but if the show would go on any other way that
would be fine too. (although I still am not happy with the loss of the
Liberator)
> And it wouldn't have been a three-way battle, because had Blake not left,
> they probably wouldn't have bothered coming up with one Captain Del
> Tarrant anyway ...
>
That's for sure!
Cheers,
Jeroen
PS: ANYTHING to get more B7
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 21 Aug 2000 08:27:09 -0400
From: "Christine+Steve" <cgorman@idirect.com>
To: "B7 Mailing List" <blakes7@lysator.liu.se>
Subject: Re: [B7L] Re:Liberator space travel
Message-ID: <00d501c00b6b$33616140$e10e9ad8@cgorman>
Content-Type: text/plain;
charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Helen Krummenacker added :
> > I was wondering if this was a slip, or does this mean the Liberator
> > routinely travels between different galaxies? I don't see this gelling
with
> > Star One - when the do leave the galaxy. I suspect Travis should have
said
> > "pushed him into this system", or something like that. Any ideas?
> >
> >
> > Steve Dobson
>
> Ah... to interpret this playing the game, rather than rolling our eyes
> at a continuity error, I would suggest that this is evidence that FTL
> occurs by dimensional shift, and Travis is referring to the Liberator
> being forced back into normal space, thus being 'within the galaxy',
> which exists within 3 spatial dimensions but is 'flat' in hyperspace,
> allowing ships to go 'outside' it to take shortcuts. Does that work for
> you?
Ahh yes, that could work. The Liberator's power drain was pretty high
giving them diminished FTL ability, so had to stay in standard space. Much
better than just a simple goof. Or maybe , as Betty says, Travis didn't do
too well in space navigation school.
Steve Dobson.
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 21 Aug 2000 13:37:23 +0100 (BST)
From: Iain Coleman <ijc@bas.ac.uk>
To: B7 Mailing List <blakes7@lysator.liu.se>
Subject: Re: [B7L] Re:Liberator space travel
Message-Id: <Pine.OSF.3.96.1000821133627.1546G-100000@bsauasc>
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
On Mon, 21 Aug 2000, Christine+Steve wrote:
>
> Ahh yes, that could work. The Liberator's power drain was pretty high
> giving them diminished FTL ability, so had to stay in standard space. Much
> better than just a simple goof. Or maybe , as Betty says, Travis didn't do
> too well in space navigation school.
Or maybe Travis had just scored some really kick-ass hallucinogens, and
was personally in a completely different galaxy.
Iain
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 21 Aug 2000 16:28:10 +0200
From: "Marian de Haan" <maya@multiweb.nl>
To: <blakes7@lysator.liu.se>
Subject: Re: [B7L] Why Not Blake II?
Message-ID: <001801c00b7c$09646ac0$afed72c3@marian-de-haan.multiweb.nl>
Content-Type: text/plain;
charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Sally wrote:
>> Seriously, I'd never accept a B7 episode with either of them recast,
unregenerate character junkie that I am (or with Vila recast, for that
matter). While there's a lot of other things I like (and a lot of the
characters that I like as well), central to my love or the show is
Blake, Avon and the complicated relationship between them, and the
wonderful chemistry between Gareth and Paul was crucial to that
appeal. It just wouldn't be a tenth as interesting without that (even
Avon and Vila - and the chemistry between those actors - just isn't as
good).<<
I agree with everything but the last bit - I think the chemistry between
Paul and Michael was as strong as between Paul and Gareth. :-)
Jeroen replied to Sally:
>You call that seriously????? So you want me to believe that you rather have
NOTHING than a brand new series bases on the original series with new
characters?
>
>You don't think that it is even remotely possible that those new characters
can have some chemistry going too???<
Nothing wrong with new characters, it's the same characters played by
different actors that would not work IMHO. For me, Avon can only be played
by Paul Darrow, Vila only by Michael Keating etc. Done by other actors,
they would simply not be the same characters!
For me the proof that recasting doesn't work is Travis. After Stephen
Greif's subtle but sinister portrayal of Travis, I could never get used to
Brian Croucher's interpretation of the character.
Now this makes me wonder if those lyst members who prefer Travis II saw S2
before they did S1? I like the theory that we prefer the one we saw first,
but of course I may be totally wrong. So, members of FINAL ACT and others,
please satisfy my curiosity.
Mind, I'm not asking for arguments why you prefer Travis I or II, I'd just
like to know if the one you prefer is the one you saw first.
The same goes to a lesser extend for S4 Avon. I saw B7 in the right
sequence and I never could adjust to Avon's different hairstyle and
behaviour in S4. But I'm aware that if I had seen that season first, when
seeing him in Space Fall I would probably have jumped up, shouting: "That's
not Avon!" :-)
Marian
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 21 Aug 2000 08:43:40 -0600
From: Betty Ragan <ragan@sdc.org>
To: B7 Lyst <blakes7@lysator.liu.se>
Subject: Re: [B7L] Why Not Blake II?
Message-ID: <39A1401C.ACEE9E4C@sdc.org>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Marian de Haan wrote:
> Now this makes me wonder if those lyst members who prefer Travis II saw S2
> before they did S1? I like the theory that we prefer the one we saw first,
> but of course I may be totally wrong. So, members of FINAL ACT and others,
> please satisfy my curiosity.
Hmm, I seem to be a data point against your theory, I'm afraid. I first
started watching the show in mid-2nd season, and thus the reign of
Travis II, but when I went back and watched the show over from the
beginning much later, I very quickly came to prefer Travis I. Of
course, the fact that the time gap there was 10 years-plus might be
relevant. I barely remembered what the second Travis *looked* like when
I got around to watching the first one.
> The same goes to a lesser extend for S4 Avon. I saw B7 in the right
> sequence and I never could adjust to Avon's different hairstyle and
> behaviour in S4. But I'm aware that if I had seen that season first, when
> seeing him in Space Fall I would probably have jumped up, shouting: "That's
> not Avon!" :-)
I can deal with S4 Avon because I watched him turn into S4 Avon. If I'd
been shown a random fourth season episode while still in my first
viewing of the 2nd season, I probably would have been appalled.
I do wonder if this theory might not hold for fans of Tarrant, and of
the latter half of the show in general. Did most Tarrant fans, say,
join the show originally during the third season (or later?). Did
3rd/4th season fans generally come in during the 3rd/4th season, or is
it more usually a case of having watched it from the beginning and
liking it more as it went along? (This is something I've been slightly
curious about for a while, I must admit.)
--
Betty Ragan ** ragan@sdc.org ** http://www.sdc.org/~ragan/
"Imposing Latin rules on English structure is a little
like trying to play baseball in ice skates." -- Bill Bryson
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 21 Aug 2000 07:37:00 -0700
From: mistral@ptinet.net
To: B7 List <blakes7@lysator.liu.se>
Subject: The Jacket (was Re: [B7L] FC: New frame captures)
Message-ID: <39A13E8B.6BF54188@ptinet.net>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Joanne MacQueen wrote:
> >From: mistral@ptinet.net
> >Thank you, Lisa. Next to white coveralls, I do believe I like
> >brown vinyl the best ;-)
>
> <winks back> With matador jackets close behind, I believe...
LOL! Apples and oranges, Joanne. The white coveralls and the brown
vinyl are faves because they're associated with favourite eps; but The
Jacket - ah! The Jacket is a thing of delight unto itself. When first
I saw it, I was convinced that there was a special place reserved in
hell for its designer, but after viewing the fourth series, I recognized
it for the clever bit of foreshadowing that it is. The Jacket is blatant
if unconscious self-mockery; it is Avon's sense of the absurd extruding
into daylight. It is both mask and revelation; says both 'this is who
I am' and 'touch me not'. Where the smocks and tunics of the first
series show us an Avon moulded by his society; where the second season
leathers show us an Avon freed from that society and its labels; where
the outfit from 'Rumors' reveals the tragic-romantic that Avon sees
himself as in his inner emotional life, The Jacket is a post-Rumors
acknowledgement that Avon has seen the fool in himself, and is ready
to get on with his life. It announcesto all he encounters: 'Love me
or hate me, but stay the hell out of my way. You have been warned.'
It is an externalization of Avon's interior landscape. It tells us....
well, you get the picture ;-)
Perhaps you could get more in touch with these things if you wrote a
filk about it?
<sigh> Just the thought of it makes me smile for at least an hour; the
sight of it provokes gales of laughter. If I were a better seamstress,
I'd try to copy it. Oh yes, The Jacket is a thing of Joy!
(Or perhaps it's just one of those laugh or cry things.)
Mistral
--
"This is silly." -- Dayna
--------------------------------
End of blakes7-d Digest V00 Issue #235
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