From: blakes7-d-request@lysator.liu.se Subject: blakes7-d Digest V00 #264 X-Loop: blakes7-d@lysator.liu.se X-Mailing-List: <blakes7-d@lysator.liu.se> archive/volume00/264 Precedence: list MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/digest; boundary="----------------------------" To: blakes7-d@lysator.liu.se Reply-To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se ------------------------------ Content-Type: text/plain blakes7-d Digest Volume 00 : Issue 264 Today's Topics: Re: [B7L] I love 1978 [ "Una McCormack" <una@q-research.con ] [B7L] Call for fiction for new B7 zi [ Tavia Chalcraft <tavia@btinternet.c ] Re: [B7L] Jarriere [ "J MacQueen" <j_macqueen@hotmail.co ] [B7L] Re: actors nice? [ Helen Krummenacker <avona@jps.net> ] [B7L] Re: blakes7 meets the hit musi [ Helen Krummenacker <avona@jps.net> ] [B7L] Re: Gareth Thomas fans--videos [ JEB31538@cs.com ] Re: [B7L] Re: Gareth Thomas fans--vi [ "Una McCormack" <una@q-research.con ] Re: [B7L] Re: actors nice? [ Bizarro7@aol.com ] Re: [B7L] Call for fiction for new B [ Tavia Chalcraft <tavia@btinternet.c ] Re: [B7L] Selected episodes (Vericon [ Harriet Monkhouse <101637.2064@comp ] Re: [B7L] Call for fiction for new B [ Judith Proctor <Judith@blakes-7.com ] Re: [B7L] Selected episodes [ "Marian de Haan" <maya@multiweb.nl> ] Re: [B7L] Call for fiction for new B [ "Neil Faulkner" <N.Faulkner@tesco.n ] Re: [B7L] Call for fiction for new B [ Tavia Chalcraft <tavia@btinternet.c ] ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 19 Sep 2000 21:05:44 +0100 From: "Una McCormack" <una@q-research.connectfree.co.uk> To: "b7" <blakes7@lysator.liu.se> Subject: Re: [B7L] I love 1978 Message-ID: <040e01c02275$00378350$0d01a8c0@codex> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit NEil wrote: > From: Mark Spencer <mark_r_spencer@hotmail.com> > > *Now* you're talking! Along with 'Dancing in the city', 'D.I.S.C.O.', the > > unrepeatable Dan Hartman's 'Instant Replay' and *anything* by Boney M! > > (Maybe "Uptown top rankin'" too...) > > Uptown Toprankin' was the first new occupant of the UK #1 slot after B7 went > on air. Which led me to realise that by by correlating nfo in Tony > Attwood's Programme Guide and the Guiness Book of British Hit SIngles, I > could produce possibly the most worthless list that ever pertained to B7, > namely what was topping the charts when the series was first broadcast. But > I would never inflict such rubbish on the Lyst, would I? What a fantastic list! And what an amazing set of number ones. Which proves that music was much better when I was a kiddie. uNA ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 19 Sep 2000 22:28:09 +0100 From: Tavia Chalcraft <tavia@btinternet.com> To: 'Freedom City mailing list' <freedom-city@blakes-7.org>, 'Lysator mailing list' <blakes7@lysator.liu.se> Subject: [B7L] Call for fiction for new B7 zine Message-ID: <01C02288.E54B2E20.tavia@btinternet.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I've been thinking for ages that I'd love to publish something in paper format again. The debate over the past few days on FC has made me think that there's definitely a demand for something printed among some people. It seems to me that the problem may lie in reaching fans effectively and persuading them to buy. One thing I feel will persuade people to buy is reduced cost -- as long as it's not at the expense of quality. Yes, Web publishing reduces cost, but _at the moment_ that is at the expense of reduced quality, at least in the eyes of many people (if only because you often tend to read it on-screen). So. I've decided to put my time, money and effort where my mouth is, and produce another print B7 zine. My aim is to produce something somewhat cheaper than the average UK zine, which has an easy-to-read, low-frills approach, taking advantage of the cheap copying to which I have access. I hope to bring you good stories, hopefully with an emphasis on longer meatier ones, well edited and presented. I don't want to abandon the other things that make print zines fun (especially nice covers and internal art), but I want to focus on the fiction first of all. I don't want to compete with the various other people out there who are busily producing zines, and particularly not with those on this side of the pond. My feeling is that there's plenty of fiction to go round, and that there are plenty of people who just need encouragement to submit their work. I also think that the people who buy zines tend to welcome new ones, whatever the people who don't buy zines think. I'd therefore welcome submissions to my zine. I would prefer longer meatier stories, preferably at least 5000 words and up to around 20 000 words or so, although I'd be happy to consider shorter and longer material too. I guess I'd primarily be looking for relatively serious, character-driven stuff. A few things I'm NOT interested in, for a variety of reasons: stories that are primarily humorous, or primarily explicit sex of whatever type, crossovers or blatant pastiche, poetry, non-fiction and anything available on the Web (stories posted to FC are ok). Other than that, pretty much anything goes ... gen, adult or slash. My copy deadline is around Christmas 2000, although earlier stuff would be nice, and I intend to have print copies available well before Redemption in February 2001. I intend to edit contributions where needed. I won't pretend to be able to give the help to writers that can be achieved with the intense Blake's Seven knowledge and fan-writing experience that some Editors have. However, I'm pretty competent in copy-editing and proofreading, and may well be able to assist with improving the presentation and flow of people's ideas. I believe that fan writers deserve to be rewarded for their hard work. Therefore I would intend to provide trib copies for people submitting >= 3 typeset pages, and discounts for those submitting less than this. If there are any profits to be had (and I don't know), then I would attempt to profit share with contributors based on their page contribution as well as other ways in which people can help. Thanks in advance for your support, I'm going to need it! Tavia --When the fire and the rose are one ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 20 Sep 2000 07:50:15 EST From: "J MacQueen" <j_macqueen@hotmail.com> To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se Subject: Re: [B7L] Jarriere Message-ID: <F634wBUTe0AmeeLUDTm0001120c@hotmail.com> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed >From: mistral@centurytel.net >Who's going to volunteer to make replicas of The Jacket, hmmm? >We'll have to draft patterns in a wide range of sizes. Can we count >on you, Joanne? <cough> Given my sewing skills, only if you want it to look as bad as my opinion of it... Regards (Having to correct herself because Una passed the capital letters bug on from Neil) _________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com. Share information about yourself, create your own public profile at http://profiles.msn.com. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 19 Sep 2000 19:18:05 -0700 From: Helen Krummenacker <avona@jps.net> To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se Subject: [B7L] Re: actors nice? Message-ID: <39C81E5D.2DA@jps.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > >I was a very big B7 fan before but now after > >meeting Gareth Thomas I am a huge huge fan > >of the actors as well - are they all as nice as Gareth? > > Not wanting to say anything against the others, but I think you started at > the top. > Well, I've met Michael Keating and Paul Darrow; both of them very good speakers at cons and friendly and pleasent to talk to one on one. "Nice" could depend on your definition; Paul tends to tease friends and audience, but that's what we like, yes? Anyhow, I'll take British stars over American ones for convention manners just about any day. Any of you remember John Levine (Sgt. Benton from Doctor Who)? He moved out to California a while back and was at a lot of conventions... and got to know my husband so well, he'd sit and chat with us for an hour on the lobby sofa. Poor fellow could never get used to my constant change of wigs/skin tone/etc, though. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 19 Sep 2000 19:23:04 -0700 From: Helen Krummenacker <avona@jps.net> To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se Subject: [B7L] Re: blakes7 meets the hit music Message-ID: <39C81F88.5486@jps.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > Children of AUron, Rumours of Death - COward of the County (Kenny Rogers). Hmmm... Children of Auron, Avon is trying to walk awway from trouble when he can. Or better yet, not go near it in the first place. And yet, next episode, goes to get revenge for his ladylove. Coincidence? *I HOPE so!* ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 19 Sep 2000 23:36:28 EDT From: JEB31538@cs.com To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se Subject: [B7L] Re: Gareth Thomas fans--videos Message-ID: <ea.af34efc.26f98abc@cs.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Tavia asked about some things: Strangers and Brothers, the 13 part BBC series (13 hours) that now is available to Americans on NTSC video (6 tapes), is the C. P. Snow work. Gareth was in episodes 8 & 9 and played the scientist Arthur Mounteney. His part is not very large--darn!! I mean there's no way I am spending over $100 to get this for the less than 20 minutes that he's in it. And I have just his parts offair anyway. So you saw The Bell several times. I hate you! (Just kidding.) You didn't happen to tape it, did you? I'd pay a fortune to get video tapes of The Bell (4 hours) and Gareth's How Green Was My Valley (6 hours). These two items are my all time top wants. Gareth has a big meaty roll in The Bell. He plays James Tayper Pace. Ian Holm is the main character Michael. Michael is the homosexual. Unfortunately, James is definitely straight. There's a great size difference between the men. I never realized how big GT is except when next to IH. (By the way, I have seen bits of this, but only bits.) I just love it when James is holding and comforting Michael near the end. It's such a sad novel/show in many ways. I've always thought that someone somewhere had to have an offair copy of The Bell. I realize that HGWMV is not as likely because it's 1976. But the BBC did say it (HGWMV) had been aired somewhere in the world sometime in the mid-80's so if anyone knows of someone who's taped it--even in a foreign language--I still want it. Joyce ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 20 Sep 2000 06:30:39 +0100 From: "Una McCormack" <una@q-research.connectfree.co.uk> To: <blakes7@lysator.liu.se> Subject: Re: [B7L] Re: Gareth Thomas fans--videos Message-ID: <04a301c022c6$4a557f40$0d01a8c0@codex> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Joyce: > I never realized how big GT is except when next to IH. Joyce, *I* would look big if you put me next to Ian Holm. I'd love to see this tho'. Ian Holm is one of my favourite actors. Una ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 20 Sep 2000 07:47:05 EDT From: Bizarro7@aol.com To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se Subject: Re: [B7L] Re: actors nice? Message-ID: <9a.9de9b8c.26f9fdb9@aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 9/19/00 11:01:36 PM Eastern Daylight Time, avona@jps.net writes: << > >I was a very big B7 fan before but now after > >meeting Gareth Thomas I am a huge huge fan > >of the actors as well - are they all as nice as Gareth? > > Not wanting to say anything against the others, but I think you started at > the top.<< I'll put a big ditto on that. Like any human being, Gareth has his flaws. To my observation over several years and contact, those flaws do *not* extend toward people he knows. He has a streak of protective idealism that is very Blakelike toward those. >>Well, I've met Michael Keating and Paul Darrow; both of them very good speakers at cons and friendly and pleasent to talk to one on one. "Nice" could depend on your definition; Paul tends to tease friends and audience, but that's what we like, yes?<< Suffice it to say that they are performers. When they are onstage, they are performing. I also had several years worth of convention and non-convention association with these actors, and I will simply reminisce that fans sometimes project a benevolent image based on the character, not the performer. Keating's an average guy, but if you hang around him long enough, you'll catch glimpses of a very sudden, sharp temper. As for Darrow, well...never forget that he will always keep his own agenda foremost, and no amount of accomplished personal charm will protect those around him when he feels it's time to promote that agenda. I don't mean this mildly. An example: When some of the other B7 actors decided to attend a convention in the US that Darrow was boycotting, he threatened to report them to the INA (Federal Immigration and Naturalization Agency). They could have been arrested at the airport or sent back to the UK. He can be wonderful, and he can be abominable. I don't care to dwell on numerous examples of each that I bear from personal experience, except to say that he's a man who needs friends and repels them through abuse as quickly as he attracts them through his charm. Enjoy Avon. >> Anyhow, I'll take British stars over American ones for convention manners just about any day.<< I will wholeheartedly agree with that sentiment...unless the British star begins to get a "Hollywood" attitude, which can happen with frightful speed and suddenness. I've seen it develop after a few conventions of adulation. One of the few exceptions: Patrick Troughton, who was an angel, no matter how many years you knew him. Gareth runs a close second. At the other end of the scale were Brit actors like the one who played a chief villain on DR WHO, and seemed to regard conventions as a license to try and seduce any attractive fan who came within reach. Another who starred in a very popular fannish secret agency series got sloshed, maudlin and very openly suicidal in front of the convention staff, and by the end of a week's worth of bad behavior, they were hoping he would jump. Nowadays, I try to avoid personal association with actors. Enjoy them onstage; they're best that way. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 20 Sep 2000 12:59:54 +0100 From: Tavia Chalcraft <tavia@btinternet.com> To: 'Lysator mailing list' <blakes7@lysator.liu.se> Subject: Re: [B7L] Call for fiction for new B7 zine (PS) Message-ID: <01C02302.AD4F0E40.tavia@btinternet.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > My copy deadline is around Christmas 2000 A few smidges of feedback have suggested that this is rather soon. If you've got something likely to come to fruition a little later than Christmas then drop me a line and we can negotiate. But I'd seriously like to get the bulk by Christmas as January's likely to be hectic with RL work. And I'm firmly committed to getting the thing out by Redemption. Tavia ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 20 Sep 2000 08:49:58 -0400 From: Harriet Monkhouse <101637.2064@compuserve.com> To: "INTERNET:blakes7@lysator.liu.se" <blakes7@lysator.liu.se> Subject: Re: [B7L] Selected episodes (Vericon) Message-ID: <200009200850_MC2-B3F0-2C85@compuserve.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Disposition: inline Una and Katie in discussion: >>I really do think that 'The Way Back' is an >> excellent introduction to the show (it *is* >> what it was written for, after all!) and can't = >>see why one wouldn't use it as such. > > It's *so* dissimilar from what follows, though; > it doesn't really give the new viewer a flavor > of the show. Blake's 7 without The Way Back makes no sense to me. I don't see how one= could understand the rest of the story without it. Not to mention it bei= ng rather good. Harriet ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 20 Sep 2000 11:59:25 +0100 (BST) From: Judith Proctor <Judith@blakes-7.com> To: "tavia@btinternet.com" <tavia@btinternet.com> Cc: 'Freedom City mailing list' <freedom-city@blakes-7.org>, 'Lysator mailing list' <blakes7@lysator.liu.se> Subject: Re: [B7L] Call for fiction for new B7 zine Message-ID: <Marcel-1.46-0920105925-06cRr9i@blakes-7.demon.co.uk> Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII Tavia, Good for you! Always lovely to see someone else having a go at publishing. I also think it's useful to have zines at various positions on the spectrum, some going the low cost no-frills route (like Neil has done) and others going for the colour cover, proper binding option as I usually do. I don't see zine editors as being in competition. There aren't masses of new B7 zines each year. If you want me to agent it when it's ready (as well as selling copies yourself), then I'm happy to do that. My only worry is that you've cut your deadline a bit tight. While I think it would be great if you could get it out by Redemption (trust me -I *love* that idea), I don't think you're allowing enough time, especially if you want longer stories. If you want to pick my brains on any aspect of zine production, just ask and I'll give you my phone number. Judith -- http://www.hermit.org/Blakes7 - Fanzines for Blake's 7, B7 Filk songs, pictures, news, Conventions past and present, Blake's 7 fan clubs, Gareth Thomas, etc. (also non-Blake's 7 zines at http://www.knightwriter.org ) Redemption '01 23-25 Feb 2001 http://www.smof.com/redemption/ ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 20 Sep 2000 19:45:06 +0200 From: "Marian de Haan" <maya@multiweb.nl> To: <Blakes7@lysator.liu.se> Subject: Re: [B7L] Selected episodes Message-ID: <005c01c0232a$895ac600$32ed72c3@marian-de-haan.multiweb.nl> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Harriet Monkhouse wrote: >Blake's 7 without The Way Back makes no sense to me. I don't see how one could understand the rest of the story without it. Not to mention it being rather good.< Well, Vila appears only towards the end and Avon isn't in it at all, which makes it not very attractive for me :-) My choice for introduction would probably be: The Way Back Space Fall Time Squad Seek-Locate-Destroy These are all episodes that introduce the regular characters, and good episodes too, IMO. Although I personally don't like The Way Back, it serves to make very clear what Blake's fight is all about. Marian ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 20 Sep 2000 20:32:29 +0100 From: "Neil Faulkner" <N.Faulkner@tesco.net> To: "b7" <blakes7@lysator.liu.se> Subject: Re: [B7L] Call for fiction for new B7 zine Message-ID: <003801c0233b$603b1020$e535fea9@neilfaulkner> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Tavia Chalcraft <tavia@btinternet.com> > I guess I'd primarily be looking for relatively serious, character-driven > stuff. A few things I'm NOT interested in, for a variety of reasons: > stories that are primarily humorous, or primarily explicit sex of whatever > type, crossovers or blatant pastiche, poetry, non-fiction That will probably cut out a lot of potential contributors, since humour loomed large in the submissions I received for my last two zines. Then again, I've not yet had any humourous fiction submitted for my latest project* (and I still need more. And I announced mine first). *This is a team-up with Judith which I've provisionally called Eric. I do have another, more B7-pertinent title, but to use the title I have to have the cover to go with it, and getting the cover right will be the most ambitious graphics job I've yet undertaken. > I intend to edit contributions where needed. I won't pretend to be able to > give the help to writers that can be achieved with the intense Blake's > Seven knowledge and fan-writing experience that some Editors have. However, > I'm pretty competent in copy-editing and proofreading, and may well be able > to assist with improving the presentation and flow of people's ideas. For factual resources, Judith's site has the full episode transcripts and the Sevencyclopaedia, and it might be worth downloading both to your hard drive. (I have for the scripts, but not the 7cyclo since I have the book. In fact, I *wrote* most of the bloody book, but I still refer to it quite often when memory fails.) You have to be careful with editorial suggestions (loud chorus of "You're a fine one to talk"), especially with artsy writers who are deliberately breaking the rules. I've had some arguments with Judith over some very silly matters, like changing the title of a story from Krieganschauung to Kriegspielen, 'alright' to 'all right' (I prefer the former, she the latter), and 'next-of-k' to 'next-of-kin', as if the abbreviated form wasn't readily comprehensible in context. The hardest part of editing, I find, is getting a story to finish neatly on the end of the page. If it falls a bit short, no great problem, but if it runs a few lines over then you can be in for a serious headache. > I believe that fan writers deserve to be rewarded for their hard work. > Therefore I would intend to provide trib copies for people submitting >= 3 > typeset pages, and discounts for those submitting less than this. Pretty standard. Don't forget artwork contributions, if you get any. I had no problems with Stadler Link because I got three cracking full-page illos from Val Westall, any one of which on its own was worth a free copy. I had no problems with Pressure Point either, because I simply used frame captures off the Web and tweaked them to black-and-white. > If there > are any profits to be had (and I don't know), then I would attempt to > profit share with contributors based on their page contribution as well as > other ways in which people can help. Any profits depend on how much your printer charges you and how much you charge. I budget to break even at best, and then end up making a loss, but I don't mind being 20 quid or so out of pocket by the time the last copy gets sold. Remember that the trib copies are free, including the postage, so if you get a lot of overseas contributors then the cost of mailing them out has to be passed on to the retailed copies. Say the zine costs L5 per copy to print, and there are seven contributors, four of them from the US. You're looking at a trib bill of L45-50, maybe more. With a print run of 50, that's at least an extra pound on the cover price of the retails, or about 50p for a print run of 100. The more you print, the less you need to surcharge, but the more you print the more likely you'll have a stack of zines piled up in a corner gathering dust for months or even years. I think you'll find the only *material* reward you stand to get is your own copy of a zine you never want to look at ever again. The non-material rewards, like pride, satisfaction, sense of kudos etc, are another matter. Someone stopping you at a con to wave a copy in your face and saying "Hey, great zine" isn't going to top up your bank balance, and neither is a glowing review on Judith's web site, but by golly gosh it feels damn good. Neil ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 20 Sep 2000 22:52:36 +0100 From: Tavia Chalcraft <tavia@btinternet.com> To: 'Lysator mailing list' <blakes7@lysator.liu.se> Subject: Re: [B7L] Call for fiction for new B7 zine Message-ID: <01C02355.7BB362C0.tavia@btinternet.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Neil wrote: >That will probably cut out a lot of potential contributors, since humour >loomed large in the submissions I received for my last two zines. Then >again, I've not yet had any humourous fiction submitted for my latest >project* (and I still need more. And I announced mine first). I haven't noticed a lack of submissions in the past 48 hours. Anything but. Torrent more like. I suspect that your reputation may scare potentials off whereas sweet little fluffy bunny rabbit Tavia ... Or maybe you are just a lot more picky about what you accept than I am ?? Actually one of the reasons for banning humour was that it appears to be 'common knowledge' that 'that Neil bloke' likes humour, so I thought I'd try not to queer your pitch too much. >which I've provisionally called Eric Mine's currently called Tavia's Terrific Blake & Avon zine, or TTBA for short (or is just some weird Cambridge joke?). But then I'm no good with titles. >Judith's site has the full episode transcripts and >the Sevencyclopaedia Love 'em both dearly. >You have to be careful with editorial suggestions I'm worried about getting a chorus of (something like) 'you mangy tosser, your story xyz on FC was *** so what right have you got to lecture to us'. But then everyone in B7 fandom is so nice, they wouldn't do that, now would they? >especially with artsy writers who are deliberately breaking the rules You mean like starting every other sentence with 'and' ? >The hardest part of editing, I find, is getting a story to finish neatly on >the end of the page. If it falls a bit short, no great problem, but if it >runs a few lines over then you can be in for a serious headache. With page layout programs you can _sometimes_ fix this by kerning paragraphs back a bit. >Any profits depend on how much your printer charges you I'm planning to print myself on my photocopier, which is my major cost-cutting device. I don't know what the quality will be like but hopefully not too bad, and reckon it will cut the cost of printing to <50% compared with prices Judith has quoted on FC. >Remember that the trib copies are free, including the postage I reckon one of my major cost drivers will be postage to US on trib copies, although I'd be quite keen on the idea of persuading friendly US fen to take them back from Redemption with them to post locally. >your own copy of a zine you never want to look at ever again Till about 3--4 years ago, I had been a journals editor all my working life. I never ever tired of getting the final print copy in my grubby little paws. And now when I don't edit for work, I miss it... >Someone stopping you at a con to wave a copy in your face and saying "Hey, >great zine" isn't going to top up your bank balance, and neither is a >glowing review on Judith's web site, but by golly gosh it feels damn good. I would no doubt be among them, if only I'd been able to get hold of a copy of the wretched things before they went out of print. Not planning a reprint are you?, says she hopefully... Tavia --When the fire and the rose are one -------------------------------- End of blakes7-d Digest V00 Issue #264 **************************************