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blakes7-d Digest Volume 00 : Issue 91
Today's Topics:
Re: [B7L] Horizon discussion
[B7L] Pat Patera as wardrobe mistress (was Horizon discussion)
Re: [B7L] horizon
Re: [B7L] Horizon discussion
Re: [B7L] Horizon (flame)
Re: [B7L] Outfits (was Horizon discussion)
Re: [B7L] Horizon (flame)
[B7L] Horizon (flame)
Re: [B7L] Volcano question
Re: [B7L] Outfits (was Horizon discussion)
Re: [B7L] Horizon discussion
[B7L] Re: RPG Female Fans
[B7L] A Commander's Lot
[B7L] credit cards
Re: [B7L] Volcano question
[B7L] Horizon (In Flames)
Re: [B7L] Horizon (flame)
[B7L] Pat Patera as wardrobe mistress
Re: [B7L] Avon's skills
Re: [B7L] Horizon (In Flames)
Re: [B7L] Avon's skills
Re: [B7L] Avon's skills
[B7L] Recent Discussion
Re: Penguins again (was [B7L] Horizon (flame))
[B7L] REM
Re: [B7L] Horizon (flame)
[B7L] Contributor's Motivations (was Horizon discussion)
Re: [B7L] Horizon discussion
Re: [B7L] Apology (was Horizon (flame))
Re: [B7L] Horizon discussion
Re: [B7L] Apology (was Horizon (flame))
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 30 Mar 2000 07:57:57 +0100
From: "Jakx" <Jakx@takerkane.freeserve.co.uk>
To: <blakes7@lysator.liu.se>
Subject: Re: [B7L] Horizon discussion
Message-ID: <005101bf9a15$48c62880$4a47883e@default>
Content-Type: text/plain;
charset="iso-8859-1"
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I`m a lurker.
I don`t like flame wars
I use delete alot recently
Jakx
----- Original Message -----
From: Pat Patera <patpatera@netzero.net>
Subject: [B7L] Horizon discussion
> Marian wrote:
> >Am I the only one who's getting thoroughly fed up with the Horizon
discussion?
>
>
> First let me say that I am not and never have been a member of Horizon.
> And Pat is my real name.
>
> I am positively bleary eyed, wading thru all those looooong vitriolic
> posts.
> I think Michael Bailey is very lucky he bailed when he did. We did not
> realize at the time that he was merely the appetizer for this feast of
> fannish fricasse-ing
>
> And I know I don't *have* to scan all those Horizon posts, but it's
> rather like driving past a grisly auto accident; one feels compelled to
> look...
>
> However, it is interesting to see some of the lurkers crawl out and
> post.
>
> I have a question: I used to get one digest a day, generally sent (I
> assume) during the low net traffic time of 1 a.m. Now I am getting 3 a
> day! Just out of curiosity, can anyone tell me how /when a digest 'sorts
> itself out' and decides it is full and time to fly away?
>
> >Can't we turn to something more entertaining, like Avon's wardrobe? :-)
>
> Yes please.
>
> What a shame that Avon never got into the spirit of things at The Big
> Wheel. Krantor and Toise were superlative in their silver bejeweled
> costumes. And Servalan was to die for in her scarlet sequins. For Avon?
> Gleaming blue-black satin, skin tight, trimmed with sparkly silvery
> diamond studded bracelets and KISS-style silver knee high boots with six
> inch platform heels. An Elvis-sized belt of silver studded with deep
> blue sapphires. For a headpiece, something with blue violet plumes, I
> think. Now picture this vision of delight doing the bosa nova with That
> Scarlet Woman.
>
> oh! be still my beating heart!
> PatPat
> --
> "Never give up. Never surrender."
> -- Galaxy Quest
>
>
> _____________________________________________
> NetZero - Defenders of the Free World
> Click here for FREE Internet Access and Email
> http://www.netzero.net/download/index.html
>
>
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 30 Mar 2000 17:09:52 EST
From: "J MacQueen" <j_macqueen@hotmail.com>
To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: [B7L] Pat Patera as wardrobe mistress (was Horizon discussion)
Message-ID: <20000330070952.90653.qmail@hotmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed
>From: Pat Patera <patpatera@netzero.net>
>trimmed with sparkly silvery diamond studded bracelets and KISS-
>style silver knee high boots with six
>inch platform heels. An Elvis-sized belt of silver studded with deep
>blue sapphires. For a headpiece, something with blue violet plumes, I
>think.
Oh, Pat! <swooning, but not with delight>
>oh! be still my beating heart!
Yeah, mine too - I'm a little young for heart attacks just yet. God help us
- a headpiece with blue violet plumes...<Joanne reeling from sudden vision
of Showgirl Avon doing the cancan>
Regards
Joanne
(sorry Pat)
______________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 30 Mar 2000 10:09:38 +0200
From: Chris <cporsch@cityweb.de>
To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: Re: [B7L] horizon
Message-ID: <38E30BC0.7DD404A5@cityweb.de>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
>
> And I wasn't aware of 'your' position in the Netherlands. Here in the UK we
> have far too many companies pushing 'free' web access on us. I know this
> procedure is replicated in all the European countries I've visited. Maybe
> in a year or so you guys will be in the same position. Roll on free local
> calls....
Well, it hasn´t reach Germany so far, that´s for sure. Over here you not only
have to pay for the access to the web, but also for the time you are online via
your telefon bill. The cheapest account I found so far is for 3.9 Pfennig the
minute ( about 2 cents a minute )
And if you are online about half an hour or an hour a day to check your e-mail
or surf the web, it really isn´t a free but a high expensive hobby to be online.
Chris from Germany
°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°
Carry on, my sweet survivor, carry on my only friend
don´t give up on your dreams, don´t you let it end.
Carry on my sweet survivor, though you know that something´s gone
For everything that matters carry on
------------------------------
Date: 30 Mar 2000 09:41:43 +0200
From: Calle Dybedahl <calle@lysator.liu.se>
To: B7 Lysator <blakes7@lysator.liu.se>
Subject: Re: [B7L] Horizon discussion
Message-ID: <86d7ochpl4.fsf@tezcatlipoca.algonet.se>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
>>>>> "Pat" == Pat Patera <patpatera@netzero.net> writes:
> I have a question: I used to get one digest a day, generally sent (I
> assume) during the low net traffic time of 1 a.m. Now I am getting 3
> a day! Just out of curiosity, can anyone tell me how /when a digest
> 'sorts itself out' and decides it is full and time to fly away?
The precise rules are a bit complex, but in essence it'll get sent
when either a certain amount of time has passed or the accumulated
postings have reached a certain size.
--
Calle Dybedahl, Vasav. 82, S-177 52 Jaerfaella,SWEDEN | calle@lysator.liu.se
Maintainer of the Blake's 7 mailing list. Mail for info.
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 30 Mar 2000 09:37:48 +0100
From: "Una McCormack" <una@q-research.connectfree.co.uk>
To: <blakes7@lysator.liu.se>
Subject: Re: [B7L] Horizon (flame)
Message-ID: <00a001bf9a23$55f33bc0$0d01a8c0@codex>
Content-Type: text/plain;
charset="iso-8859-1"
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Trish:
> Trish wondered:
>
> > Otherwise shut up or fuck off.
> >
> > Neil
> >
> >
> > Neil, will you marry me?
>
> Una responded:
> Get in line, girl, or I'll tear your hair out ;)
>
>
> Oh dear, I see another duel emerging. I suppose I have to throw the
fishies
> from this side of the Atlantic and count on Paul Darrow physics for them
to
> reach you...
It's OK, I've got my penguins trained to pick them up for me.
Una
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 30 Mar 2000 08:44:11 GMT
From: "Mat Shayde" <dorian17@hotmail.com>
To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: Re: [B7L] Outfits (was Horizon discussion)
Message-ID: <20000330084411.19863.qmail@hotmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed
>> >(Actually, I'm more concerned about some
>> >of the awful costumes that Vil awas lumbered with. What *did* Michael do
>>to
>> >upset the costume designer!?)
>>
>>Which costume do you have in mind? The only really awful one I can think
>>of
>>is that traffic warden's gear from Pressure Point. But with Servalan's
>>and
>>Avon's outfits drawing my attention, I only notice those of the others
>>when
>>they're exceptionally bad :-)
>
>Most of Vila's costume seem to be shapeless things in a nasty shade of shit
>brown. Horrible. The tarffic warden one *is* awful, (but then so many in
>Pressure Point are! Where's the dinner party that Jenna and Cally are going
>to? I mean Servalan in evening dress I can cope with, but hardened guerilla
>fighter and smugglers?) but then I hate the one he wears in Breakdown (and
>much of the 1st series) that is orange, brown and red and buttons up the
>front and makes him look like he has really hunched shoulders. The nasty
>grey pyjamas with a sash from CATEOTW is fairly horrible/silly too. And teh
>yellow trousers from Redemption. And....
>
>Oh poor Michael, the list goes on. :)
Actually, although I haven';t changed my opinion about Vila's costumes,
*nothing* he gets to wear is quite as bad as Bran Foster's costume from The
Way Back. I mean, I know he's on the run and everything, but please! :)
Dorian - "You mean you're here by choice?"
______________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 30 Mar 2000 08:44:43 GMT
From: "Mat Shayde" <dorian17@hotmail.com>
To: N.Faulkner@tesco.net, blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: Re: [B7L] Horizon (flame)
Message-ID: <20000330084443.52425.qmail@hotmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed
>Mat wrote:
> > Excuse me Mr Faulkner - I have never accused Diva of being Diane. I
>don't
> > care who he/she/it is and respect her right to use a pseudonym as much
>as
>I
> > wopuld hope she resepcts mine.
>
>Then excuse *me*, Mr [insert real name here], but my flame was directed to
>the two of you since you are both clearly acquainted with each other
Nope - I have no idea who he is and have never met him, nor indeed had I
ever heard of him before last week.
and
>have both adopted the same negative approach to appraising the shortcomings
>of Horizon.
>The matter is not worth pursuing if the two of you persist in doing so in
>such a juvenile manner.
There are a great many people here with a negative approach to Horizon's
shortcomings, yourself included.
I haven't said anything that you haven't endorsed form your own posts and
experiences. I have no wish to argue with you Neil but maybe you ought to
re-read some of my posts about Horizon before accusing me of being juvenile.
All I have said is that Diane seems to be intent on running Horizon as her
own personal kingdom (and a comment about her taking her title as Supreme
Commander a little too seriously.) a fact that you have substantiated. If
anything you have been rather more vituperative about her than I have. Other
than that, and a few comments about lack of democracy, I have not been rude,
(merely critical) I have made no comment about her health, I *haven't*
accused Diva of being anyone, nor have I accused Diane of being hidden here
under a pseudonym. Whilst I understand that tempers are getting a little
frayed I do resent being accused of juvenile behaviour in what I consider to
be a serious debate that concerns all of Blake's 7 fandom.
______________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 30 Mar 2000 11:18:31 GMT
From: "Mat Shayde" <dorian17@hotmail.com>
To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: [B7L] Horizon (flame)
Message-ID: <20000330111831.58077.qmail@hotmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed
I appear to have sent this post twice in error. Appologies, I thought that I
had cancelled the first one before it went (as I had more to add) but
apparently not.
Ooops!
Dorian - "You mean you're here by choice?"
______________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 30 Mar 2000 03:44:27 PST
From: "Sally Manton" <smanton@hotmail.com>
To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: Re: [B7L] Volcano question
Message-ID: <20000330114427.79964.qmail@hotmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed
Jeroen wrote:
<Ok you are right about this but if you look at it like this: (Rescue! Not
Stardrive) Turn on tv, see Resque, WOW this looks interesting. Then comes
Power; the two people I showed this liked it so much they wanted to see the
rest.>
<Now when you look at is again ..... :) (So I meant first time viewing)>
<grin> as far as I can remember (it was a looong time ago) I first came in
somewhere round Redemption/Horizon/Shadow...and the latter remains my
absolute most adored episode, Redemption not far behind. Wonderful way to
start (that first view of Our Heroes in Shadow *still* makes me still up...)
Sally
Also PS - Power is too worse than Animals. So is Stardrive. Moloch and The
Keeper are better but far more hateable. (Errr...oh dear, Una, does this
make me an Animals fan???)
______________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 30 Mar 2000 03:48:18 PST
From: "Sally Manton" <smanton@hotmail.com>
To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: Re: [B7L] Outfits (was Horizon discussion)
Message-ID: <20000330114818.89624.qmail@hotmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed
Dorian wrote:
<Actually, I'm more concerned about some of the awful costumes that Vil awas
lumbered with. What did Michael do to upset the costume designer!?) >
Yeees, the Pressure Point flatworm is fairly ghastly, and his entire 1st
season wardrobe looks like it came out of Zen's rag-bag. And the cardigan he
wears in Kairos...oh dear.
But then, he also wears black rather nicely - that's a very nice pair of
tight leather trousers he's wearing in Killer (yes, yes, so they ain't
Avon's red work of art from Weapon and Dawn, but then neither is Vila the
work of art that Snarly is); he looks quite wonderful in that lovely black
shirt in Weapon, and I like him better than Tarrant in Federation black. And
he looks good in the pale yellow duds in Shadow (but then everyone looks
gorgeous in Shadow except Cally - and that's Cally. Auron fashion sense just
is - errr - unique.)
______________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 30 Mar 2000 15:26:01 +0100
From: Russ Massey <russ@wriding.demon.co.uk>
To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: Re: [B7L] Horizon discussion
Message-ID: <1QhZ1CA5P244Ewen@wriding.demon.co.uk>
As a (mostly) lurker, I have to say that the current Horizon thread has
provided me with more thrills and enjoyment than discussions of
Avon's costumes ever have.
Lets face it, it's a lot more fun to discuss/tear apart/support the foibles
and failings of real people than those of fictional characters. Fandom
allows the vicarious enjoyment of real world politics and back-biting
but (usually) without the million dollar lawsuits and/or assaults with a
deadly weapon that such things can occasion.
I still am a member of Horizon. I know and like Judith (Proctor) and
Neil (not likely to be mistaken for another Neil). Anyone else posting
on this list I have spoken a couple of sentences to at most. I have no axe
to grind, since Horizon never done me wrong in any way. I do
remember the enormous impact that receiving that first issue of
Horizon had on me when I subscribed all those years ago, and
whatever the current state of the society I think it only fair to say that
it (and Diane) deserve a heck of a lot of praise for keeping B7 fandom
in the public eye over the decades.
But please, keep the vituperation coming. It's actually got me
considering writing a post analysing Cally's character and motivations
on an episode-by-episode basis - anything to avoid another 50 posts
describing the slight motion of Avon's ring finger as it pertains to his
ambivalent emotional responses to Blake :)
--
Russ Massey
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 30 Mar 2000 10:42:23 -0500
From: "Dana Shilling" <dshilling@worldnet.att.net>
To: "b7" <blakes7@lysator.liu.se>
Subject: [B7L] Re: RPG Female Fans
Message-ID: <008e01bf9a5e$fe205b80$05ac4e0c@dshilling>
Content-Type: text/plain;
charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
An online game called Sissyfight 2000 (www.sissyfight.com) seems to have a
certain relevance here. Two to five players can customize their avatars
somewhat (they're all little girls in parochial school uniforms, no black
leather options to date). Although the game includes a certain amount of
hair-pulling and scratching, primary modes of play are typing insults into
text bubbles and ganging up on one another. A player whose "self-esteem
points" are reduced from 10 to 0 gets booted out of the game. Hmmm...so
that's where Blake went during Series 3.
-(Y)
Re the Horizon video: possible effect of contact with Blake Witch, footage
found two years later?
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 30 Mar 2000 19:33:38 +0100 (BST)
From: Judith Proctor <Judith@blakes-7.com>
To: Lysator List <Blakes7@lysator.liu.se>
cc: Freedom City <freedom-city@blakes-7.org>
Subject: [B7L] A Commander's Lot
Message-ID: <Marcel-1.46-0330183338-965Rr9i@blakes-7.demon.co.uk>
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII
A Commander's Lot
(to the tune of A Policeman's Lot by Mr. Gilbert and Mr. Sullivan)
by Judith Proctor and Kathryn Andersen
When an officer's not engaged in his employment - his employment
Or maturing his felonious little plans - little plans
His capacity for innocent enjoyment - 'cent enjoyment
Is just the same as any other man's - other man's
I dream about the man I'd like to smother - like to smother
And whose arms and legs I'd really love to break - love to break
He's a child-molesting bastard with no mother - with no mother
And I really want to kill that bastard Blake - bastard Blake
When there's Federation duty to be done - to be done
A Commander's lot is *such* a happy one - happy one
When I've spent the day a-massacring rebels - 'cring rebels
And kicked the bleeding bodies on the floor - on the floor
I like to go back home and feed my goldfish - feed my goldfish
With minced-up pieces of the cat next door - cat next door.
Then I like in bed at night asleep and dreaming - sleep and dreaming
And I think I've caught Blake in a cunning trap - cunning trap
But then I find that Servalan's a-scheming - 'lan's a-scheming
And she's carefully fixed it so I take the rap - take the rap
When there's Federation duty to be done - to be done
A Commander's lot is such a risky one - risky one
(inspired by watching Seek-Locate-Destroy)
(typed by Kathryn, with Judith peering over shoulder making comments)
(okay, making *snide* comments)
(she said it, not me)
K & J
--
http://www.hermit.org/Blakes7 - Fanzines for Blake's 7, B7 Filk songs,
pictures, news, Conventions past and present, Blake's 7 fan clubs, Gareth
Thomas, etc. (also non-Blake's 7 zines at http://www.nas.com/~lknight )
Redemption '01 23-25 Feb 2001 http://www.smof.com/redemption/
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 30 Mar 2000 19:17:09 +0100 (BST)
From: Judith Proctor <Judith@blakes-7.com>
To: Lysator List <Blakes7@lysator.liu.se>
cc: Freedom City <freedom-city@blakes-7.org>
Subject: [B7L] credit cards
Message-ID: <Marcel-1.46-0330181709-bbaRr9i@blakes-7.demon.co.uk>
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII
The credit card facility for zine ordering is now operational on our website.
Please note that we do not store card numbers on the site (in fact we never see
the card number at all as that part of the transaction is handled via the card
company). This means that although we can store your name and address between
visits, you will have to input your card number each time. This is a security
feature, so we hope you won't mind.
You can choose which currency you want to be billed in. The options are UK
pounds, Deutschmarks, US$, AUS$ and Euros. The prices are listed in these
currencies.
(If you live outside one of these currency areas, you can still place an order,
but we cannot guarantee the exact amount that will be deducted from your card as
we don't know what currency conversion rate your card company will use. With
the above, currency conversion costs are already included and the rate is a good
one.)
We'll be integrating the ordering system into all the individual zine pages over
the next few weeks to make everything easier to use.
Judith (and Richard)
PS. My apologies to anyone I owe mail to - typing is very painful at present.
Kathryn's helping me with the filks <smile>.
--
http://www.hermit.org/Blakes7 - Fanzines for Blake's 7, B7 Filk songs,
pictures, news, Conventions past and present, Blake's 7 fan clubs, Gareth
Thomas, etc. (also non-Blake's 7 zines at http://www.nas.com/~lknight )
Redemption '01 23-25 Feb 2001 http://www.smof.com/redemption/
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 30 Mar 2000 20:01:18 +0100
From: "Una McCormack" <una@q-research.connectfree.co.uk>
To: <blakes7@lysator.liu.se>
Subject: Re: [B7L] Volcano question
Message-ID: <006c01bf9a7a$584b7110$0d01a8c0@codex>
Content-Type: text/plain;
charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Sally:
> Also PS - Power is too worse than Animals. So is Stardrive. Moloch and The
> Keeper are better but far more hateable. (Errr...oh dear, Una, does this
> make me an Animals fan???)
Near as damn it, I'm afraid.
Una
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 30 Mar 2000 19:18:07 GMT
From: "David Fielding" <davidft10@hotmail.com>
To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: [B7L] Horizon (In Flames)
Message-ID: <20000330191807.42839.qmail@hotmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed
Neil Faulkner said
>Then excuse *me*, Mr [insert real name here], but my flame was directed to
>the two of you since you are both clearly acquainted with each other and
>have both adopted the same negative approach to appraising the shortcomings
>of Horizon.
>
>The matter is not worth pursuing if the two of you persist in doing so in
>such a juvenile manner.
Fuck off Neil, you complete hypocrite!
You've been putting the well deserved boot into Horizon as much as anyone
else.
Now your lording it about as if your criticism is more valid than anyone
else's.
I've never met Mat, so don't just accuse people without any evidence.
I bet you think you are Avon strutting up and down in your studded boots,
with women falling at your feet... :)
I think you sound more like Gan.
Bye the way, take heed when you look through H39.5, I think the pages are
coated with Pylene 50.
David F.
______________________________________________________
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------------------------------
Date: Thu, 30 Mar 2000 14:46:53 EST
From: Prmolloy@aol.com
To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: Re: [B7L] Horizon (flame)
Message-ID: <48.36cd80e.2615092d@aol.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
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Trish:
Trish wondered:
>
> > Otherwise shut up or fuck off.
> > Neil
> >
> > Neil, will you marry me?
>
> Una responded:
> Get in line, girl, or I'll tear your hair out ;)
>
>
> Oh dear, I see another duel emerging. I suppose I have to throw the
fishies from this side of the Atlantic and count on Paul Darrow physics for
them
to reach you...
It's OK, I've got my penguins trained to pick them up for me.
Una
No penguins here alas, but I do have 16+ years of Catholic school behind me.
BTW Una, I'm starting to see a correlation between these trained animals and
your affection for *that* episode. What was it called?
Trish
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 30 Mar 2000 20:06:08 +0100
From: Julia Jones <julia.lysator@jajones.demon.co.uk>
To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Cc: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: [B7L] Pat Patera as wardrobe mistress
Message-ID: <PZrk$SAgW644Ew5x@jajones.demon.co.uk>
In message <20000330070952.90653.qmail@hotmail.com>, J MacQueen
<j_macqueen@hotmail.com> writes
>Yeah, mine too - I'm a little young for heart attacks just yet. God help us
>- a headpiece with blue violet plumes...<Joanne reeling from sudden vision
>of Showgirl Avon doing the cancan>
Sounds horribly like something you'd find if you rummaged around in Leah
and Annie's file of "things too way-out even for Bizarro".
--
Julia Jones
"Don't philosophise with me, you electronic moron!"
The Turing test - as interpreted by Kerr Avon.
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 30 Mar 2000 10:08:52 +0100
From: "Andrew Ellis" <Andrew.D.Ellis@btinternet.com>
To: <blakes7@lysator.liu.se>
Subject: Re: [B7L] Avon's skills
Message-ID: <00ed01bf9a2c$57db6da0$56a201d5@leanet.futures.bt.co.uk>
Content-Type: text/plain;
charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Ellynne G.
>True, the
>Federation may take CA's 'plague' seriously, since they wouldn't let
>anyone off the ship and the planet may consequently be for lifers only.
>Then again, the locals aren't sociable and there may have been other
>reasons for not letting any of the crew off. If they'd believed in the
>plague, they might have told the crew to take level 4 biohazard
>precautions or something (although you can never tell with the
>Federation).
I might have forgotten something again, but I get the impression that the
Captain didn't want to waste time on shore leave on CA because it was a
dump. The Federation might not even know about the "plague", or even care.
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 30 Mar 2000 10:04:44 +0100
From: "Andrew Ellis" <Andrew.D.Ellis@btinternet.com>
To: <blakes7@lysator.liu.se>
Subject: Re: [B7L] Horizon (In Flames)
Message-ID: <00ec01bf9a2c$56e749a0$56a201d5@leanet.futures.bt.co.uk>
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From: David Fielding <davidft10@hotmail.com>
>Neil Faulkner said
>>The matter is not worth pursuing if the two of you persist in doing so in
>>such a juvenile manner.
>
>Fuck off Neil, you complete hypocrite!
Your attitude say's it all David.
Dear all. Please keep the word Horizon in the subject field for this. My
first thought was correct. There is not, and will be no common ground on
this subject, and if this is the level people will sink to in order to ram a
point across then I'm not downloading any more of this stuff.
Spam filter ON.
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 30 Mar 2000 10:40:05 +0100
From: "Andrew Ellis" <Andrew.D.Ellis@btinternet.com>
To: "B7 List" <blakes7@lysator.liu.se>
Subject: Re: [B7L] Avon's skills
Message-ID: <00ef01bf9a2c$5a688120$56a201d5@leanet.futures.bt.co.uk>
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From: mistral@ptinet.net
>
>New thought: while it's true that he's remarkable with computers,
>it's also true that his hacking into the *banking* system may
>have been less than expert; there are a great many different
>specialities among computer professionals even now.
>
People seem to have a problem with Avon's range of talents (which is how
this thread started). To whit
Technical skills
--------------------
Top flight computer technician (hardware AND software).
robotic engineering
Able to pick computer based locks.
Grasp of physics required for teleportation.
Assorted science
Lateral and Logical thinking
archaeologist / materials scientist
electrician
engineer
mathematician
Aware of the need for background research
Military skills
------------------
Confident at using hand guns.
encryption systems
arms recognition
acquaintances
Close combat skills
Strategist
Personal skills
-------------------
Leadership.
taste for wearing black!
Physical fitness
Expert kisser
Wit.
master of stand up put downs
gambler
Space skills
----------------
Passable pilot skills
Now, imagine a military state, where advanced weaponry and transportation
systems are key to keeping ahead of the rebels / acquiring new territory. It
is quite possible that a military research establishment existed, populated
by military personnel who undergo basic training and refresher courses. In
this environment you need to be a master of put downs, natural leaders
emerge, people learn to suppress emotions. They gamble and philander, and
like black leather uniforms. Now within this research establishment, there
will be opportunities for a top computer scientist to be assigned to other
projects, such as obtaining materials (field work involved) for a matter
transport system (some aspects of which were subcontracted out to civil
institutions, such as the one with Blake in it - its a big project). They
might be transferred to robotic systems projects, and their main job might
be for their team to design, construct and program advanced computer
systems.
Sound like somebody we know ?
Whilst planning the bank fraud, clearly encryption and security systems are
the sort of things that you would read up on. I think that covers it all.
Avon was a Lieutenant in the military research establishment who teamed up
with some other people to pull off a military coup, for which they needed
lots of money.
Andrew
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 30 Mar 2000 10:19:37 +0100
From: "Andrew Ellis" <Andrew.D.Ellis@btinternet.com>
To: "B7 List" <blakes7@lysator.liu.se>
Subject: Re: [B7L] Avon's skills
Message-ID: <00ee01bf9a2c$58c4e340$56a201d5@leanet.futures.bt.co.uk>
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From: mistral@ptinet.net
>my
>interpretation then and now is that his acquaintance with
>Anna Grant imperilled her function as Bartholomew should
>he remain on Earth in a position to run into her accidentally.
>Her expertise would obviously be more valuable than his.
You don't put you top top agent onto a meagre bank fraud. If you need to do
that, you really are in trouble. So I think Anna (real name because of
brothers actions), who reports to the Federation as Bartholomew, and lives a
civil life as Sula either.
1) Already knew Avon before he got into the Fraud etc and "bagsied" an easy
assignment. This explains why, on this mission, she has to use her real
name.
2) Avon was into something bigger. The bank fraud was part of something.
That's why Bartholomew was "running" Avon. To get at the other people
involved. Not involved in the bank fraud, but the "grand plan". In this
scenario, Avon is so immediately hostile to Blake because Avon's team was
actually going to succeed, but Blake's outfit got wiped out and to make
matters worse Blake got all the headlines. There was no way Avon would want
to be associated with being one of Blakes crew, he wanted to run the
revolution. But why does Anna use her real name in this scenario ?
Andrew
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 31 Mar 2000 00:14:40 +0100
From: "Andy Hopkinson" <andyrh@netcomuk.co.uk>
To: "Lysator" <blakes7@lysator.liu.se>
Subject: [B7L] Recent Discussion
Message-ID: <000701bf9a9d$b9eb1ec0$f5e52ac2@andyrh>
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I've kept quiet in the discussion about Horizon 39.5 because I obviously
have
biased feelings on the subject. Diane has had the courtesy to put the bare
minimum of our dispute in the public forum and I'm going to respect that. I
shall therefore be extremely brief.
After producing issue 39, Alan and I went on to produce issue 40. The
magazine
although completed did not meet with Diane's approval. After it became
clear
that we were not going to reach a compromise agreement, Diane decided to
start
again from scratch.
Diane has offered to make our correspondence privately available to anyone
who
wants to view it. Alan and I are happy to do the same.
It has been said by several people on this list that if you don't like what
Horizon do, you should try doing something else yourself.
We are.
Alan and I will be publishing a B7 magazine of our own. It's an experiment.
We
don't know if it will be a success so we're only trying one issue initially.
If
people like it, we'll do another.
It's not a fan club. It's not intended to replace Horizon. We'll be happy
to
sell copies through Horizon, Avon, Judith Proctor or anyone else who is
interested.
Andy Hopkinson.
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 30 Mar 2000 00:55:30 PST
From: "Sally Manton" <smanton@hotmail.com>
To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: Re: Penguins again (was [B7L] Horizon (flame))
Message-ID: <20000330085530.13718.qmail@hotmail.com>
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Trish and Una:
<I suppose I have to throw the fishies from this side of the Atlantic and
count on Paul Darrow physics for them to reach you...>
<It's OK, I've got my penguins trained to pick them up for me.>
Speakaing of, I dreamt about that looovely picture Neil gave us of the
penguin and crew in Kairos. Sad thing is, the plot made rather more sense
(and after all, the penguin *is* cuter the entire cast except My
Darling...and nearly as cute as him).
______________________________________________________
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------------------------------
Date: Thu, 30 Mar 2000 09:55:19 +0100
From: Alison Page <alison_page@becta.org.uk>
To: "'blakes7@lysator.liu.se'" <blakes7@lysator.liu.se>
Subject: [B7L] REM
Message-ID: <21B0197931E1D211A26E0008C79F6C4AB0C4B1@BRAMLEY>
Content-Type: text/plain
I've been on a bit of a lyrics kick this week. REM lyrics work well in the
songs, but frankly look rubbish when you write them down. But have you ever
heard 'losing my religion'? Mr Stipe is perhaps a B7 fan (she wildly
speculated)
----------------
Like a hurt lost and blinded fool
Oh no I've said too much
'I set it up'
Consider this
The slip that bought me to my knees
Failed
I said too much
I didn't say enough
I thought I heard you laughing
I think I thought I saw you try
But that was just a dream
Just a dream
-----------------
Alright, I admit this is probably the Rorschach effect, but it keeps me
amused
Alison
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 30 Mar 2000 10:10:19 GMT
From: "Mat Shayde" <dorian17@hotmail.com>
To: N.Faulkner@tesco.net, blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: Re: [B7L] Horizon (flame)
Message-ID: <20000330101019.6680.qmail@hotmail.com>
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>From: "Neil Faulkner" <N.Faulkner@tesco.net>
>To: "b7" <blakes7@lysator.liu.se>
>Subject: Re: [B7L] Horizon (flame)
>Date: Thu, 30 Mar 2000 07:27:21 +0100
>
>Mat wrote:
> > Excuse me Mr Faulkner - I have never accused Diva of being Diane. I
>don't
> > care who he/she/it is and respect her right to use a pseudonym as much
>as
>I
> > wopuld hope she resepcts mine.
>
>Then excuse *me*, Mr [insert real name here], but my flame was directed to
>the two of you since you are both clearly acquainted with each other
Nope,I've never met him, I have no idea who he is and until last week I had
never even heard of him. Sorry.
and
>have both adopted the same negative approach to appraising the shortcomings
>of Horizon.
>
>The matter is not worth pursuing if the two of you persist in doing so in
>such a juvenile manner.
>
>Neil
There are a great many people on this list who have a negative attitdue ro
the shortcomings of Horizon, yourself included.
I haven't said anything in my posts that hasn't been substantiated by what
you have said in yours.
I have no wish to argue with you Neil as you come across as being
intelligent and reasonable, however I feel that maybe you ought to re-read
some of my posts before accusing me of being juvenile.
I haven't made any personal comments about Diane apart from saying that she
seems to want to run Horizon as her personal kingdom, (and a flippant
comment about her taking her title of Supreme Commander a little too
seriously.) a fact which you yourself have commented (and indeed elaborated)
upon. I have made no reference to her health issues, I *haven't* accused
Diva of being Diane (or of being Sharon Eckman) nor have I accused Diane of
hiding here under another pseudonym. Nor have I indulged in any personal
attacks against other posters. (except for my understandable anger at Judith
Rolls' abuse of her possition as an ex committee member, a fact that several
other people have commented upon.)
I have made some sarcastic comments about the way that Horizon is run, the
cliquey-ness, the lack of democracy/freedom of speech and the lateness of
the newsletters - all issues that you have raised yourself. Nor are you
adverse to the occasional bit of sarcasm.
I understand that tempers are getting a bit frayed, however I do resent
being dismissed as juvenile in a discussion about important issues which
have a serious impact on all of Blake's 7 fandom.
As I said in one of my earlier posts, I take no pleasure in this, I was once
proud and happy to be a member of Horizon, however I feel that it has
seriously lost it's way and no longer provides a healthy, stable and
inclusive fan environment.
Dorian - "You mean you're here by choice?"
______________________________________________________
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------------------------------
Date: Thu, 30 Mar 2000 23:13:05 EST
From: Pherber@aol.com
To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: [B7L] Contributor's Motivations (was Horizon discussion)
Message-ID: <9c.291c223.26157fd1@aol.com>
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In a message dated 3/29/00 11:33:56 PM Mountain Standard Time,
patpatera@netzero.net writes:
<< And I know I don't *have* to scan all those Horizon posts, but it's
rather like driving past a grisly auto accident; one feels compelled to
look... >>
So true.
<< However, it is interesting to see some of the lurkers crawl out and
post. >>
So, what is it about mudslinging that inspires lurkers to drop the shields,
when less heated discussions don't? Seriously - I'm curious about this.
What sort of things make you want to respond to a discussion, or stay quiet?
Personally, I tend to gawk at stuff like the Horizon thread without
responding to it per se. OTOH, most other discussions I react to as extended
conversations -- sometimes they evoke smart-alecky, brief responses and at
other times a carefully thought-out paragraph or two. I *do* appreciate the
restraint on this list toward minimalist "me too" responses, and I'm
frequently in awe of the lengthy, considered debates that many folks on this
list contribute to.
So how about it? If you're not a frequent (or even occasional) poster,
what's the reason? Let's hear some more words from the lurkers!
Nina
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 30 Mar 2000 23:13:02 EST
From: Pherber@aol.com
To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: Re: [B7L] Horizon discussion
Message-ID: <77.2988a63.26157fce@aol.com>
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In a message dated 3/30/00 7:46:08 AM Mountain Standard Time,
russ@wriding.demon.co.uk writes:
<< But please, keep the vituperation coming. It's actually got me
considering writing a post analysing Cally's character and motivations
on an episode-by-episode basis >>
You mean she has some? I hadn't really noticed. With all those other people
moving in and out of her head, seems hard to say what's *her* and what's not.
<g>
<<- anything to avoid another 50 posts
describing the slight motion of Avon's ring finger as it pertains to his
ambivalent emotional responses to Blake :) >>
Oh dear, have we been rambling on about Snarly again? Don't sugar-coat it,
Russ, tell us how you really feel! <snicker>
Nina
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 31 Mar 2000 07:05:27 +0100
From: "Neil Faulkner" <N.Faulkner@tesco.net>
To: "b7" <blakes7@lysator.liu.se>
Subject: Re: [B7L] Apology (was Horizon (flame))
Message-ID: <001c01bf9adb$0aaeb3c0$e535fea9@neilfaulkner>
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Mat
Having found the time to reread all your posts on the subject of Horizon I
can only concede that I've been every bit as mistaken as you assert.. Your
own comments
on the management and efficiency of Horizon, and your remarks directly
concerning Diane Gies, do not warrant such descriptions as 'juvenile' or
'infantile', nor did they ever descend to a level of personal abuse
inappropriate to the subject.
The way your posts were interspersed with those of 'David Fielding' led to
some of the tone of his rantings infecting my perception of your own
posts. There is, however, no excuse for that.
Quite why I came to believe that you and 'David' were acting in tandem I
cannot, in retrospect, even begin to fathom. I can trace no evidence for
such a collusion and fully retract my insinuation that such existed.
In short, re your comments on Diane Gies and the Horizon club, I owe you an
apology, which I unreservedly offer. Which is not necessarily to say that I
agree with everything you said on the subject, but I can find no grounds for
my criticism of the way you said it.
That includes my exhortation to "shut up or fuck off", insofar as it was
directed at you personally. Vis a vis 'David Fielding' it still stands, and
he seems to have done one or the other or both. There is no reason for you
to do either, nor would I wish you to.
Neil
"I am not a man, I am a free number."
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 30 Mar 2000 22:31:27 PST
From: "Sally Manton" <smanton@hotmail.com>
To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: Re: [B7L] Horizon discussion
Message-ID: <20000331063127.5116.qmail@hotmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed
Russ wrote:
<- anything to avoid another 50 posts describing the slight motion of Avon's
ring finger as it pertains to his ambivalent emotional responses to Blake
:)>
<anguished wail> but Russ, we can't stop now, we've only done Avon's *left*
ring finger...
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------------------------------
Date: Fri, 31 Mar 2000 09:13:06 +0100
From: "Una McCormack" <una@q-research.connectfree.co.uk>
To: "b7" <blakes7@lysator.liu.se>
Subject: Re: [B7L] Apology (was Horizon (flame))
Message-ID: <019e01bf9aeb$96d00330$0d01a8c0@codex>
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Neil wrote:
> Mat
<snip>
> In short, re your comments on Diane Gies and the Horizon club, I owe you
an
> apology, which I unreservedly offer. Which is not necessarily to say that
I
> agree with everything you said on the subject, but I can find no grounds
for
> my criticism of the way you said it.
Bravo, Neil.
Here, have some extra fish.
Una
--------------------------------
End of blakes7-d Digest V00 Issue #91
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