From tariqas-digest-approval@europe.std.com Wed Aug 28 17:42:21 1996 Date: Mon, 26 Aug 1996 16:57:28 -0400 (EDT) From: tariqas-digest-approval@europe.std.com Reply-To: tariqas-digest@world.std.com To: tariqas-digest@world.std.com Subject: tariqas-digest V1 #110 tariqas-digest Monday, 26 August 1996 Volume 01 : Number 110 ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Steve H Rose Date: Sun, 25 Aug 1996 00:13:56 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Hakim Chishti (fwd) Assalamu alaikum, If you have any information on Hakim Chishti, PLEASE only send it by direct email to CMBH71C@prodigy.com rather than to the tariqas list (Please don't include your information in a response to this message). Thanks! Habib Rose host of tariqas Forwarded message: From: CMBH71C@prodigy.com (MS SHELLEY V CORBIN) Date: Fri, 23 Aug 1996 00:20:54, -0500 To: tariqas@world.std.com Subject: Hakim Chishti I am looking for how to contact a man named Hakim Chishti, who has written a books on Sufi and Unani medicine. Do you know how to contact him? ------------------------------ From: Steve H Rose Date: Sun, 25 Aug 1996 00:21:05 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Limits (fwd) Date: Sat, 24 Aug 1996 19:32:56 +0800 Message-Id: <199608241132.TAA23684@leonis.nus.sg> X-Sender: sci30342@leonis.nus.sg X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: sci30342@nus.sg, tariqas@world.std.com From: Joshi Subject: Limits as salaamu 'alaikum "Bury your existence in the earth of obscurity, for whatever sprouts forth, without having first been buried, flowers imperfectly." [Shaykh Ibn'Ata'Illah; Hikam] "...every man or woman born contains the possibility of being something infinitely more than a short-lived creature on this short-lived earth, just as a seed contains in virtuality a great tree. What we can be, we must be, or utterly fail." [Gai Eaton-- King of the Castle] "If I should will something that my Lord does not will for me, I should then be guitly of unbelief."-- Rabi'a al Adawiyya. O God, You called, and we were slow. Alas! alas! what we did we did in poor judgement. ------------------------------ From: Craig Johannsen Date: Sat, 24 Aug 1996 23:37:04 -0500 Subject: Re: Friend of Allah? (fwd) Asim Jalis wrote: > [snip] > The real solution seems to me to avoid these people [atheists] altogether. > But how is this compatible with loving them? > [snip] My opinion is don't ignore them. You can learn from them and they can learn from you. But perhaps arguing about religion should be avoided. You both start from different premises, so arguing will rarely get you anywhere. But telling stories and asking questions can be very interesting and very instructive and can be a starting point for a meaningful discussion. For example, "If you somehow acquired a million dollars, how much of it would you give away to people who really need it?" It probably wouldn't hurt to mention that your religion encourages (requires) that you give away some of your wealth (or whatever). Thinking about how you might answer his/her next question (e.g., "Why?") can strengthen your own belief and help clarify your own understanding. > Another issue is if my faith is so weak that just a brief conversation > with an atheist brings on a major moral crisis, is that not something > to worry about? > [snip] This is probably a result of arguing, which is nearly always fruitless when religion is the topic. An act of generosity or love can have a very big impact on an atheist -- maybe more than their negative impact on you. And that can strengthen your faith too. The person who is an atheist today may be a believer tomorrow! The intelligent and truly knowledgeable atheist knows he is standing on metaphysical sand (hopefully not on me; I am one of those grains of sand). ;-) Wa salaam, Craig ------------------------------ From: sarmad@ezonline.com (James Brody) Date: Sun, 25 Aug 1996 19:12:45 GMT Subject: Re: Friend of Allah? (fwd) On Sat, 24 Aug 96 22:58:47 CDT, you wrote: > >A related issue is that of people who are atheist. I am torn about >whether I should quickly change the subject with them if they bring up >the issue of God or whether to wait and hear out their ideas. I am >more attracted to the first but end up doing the second in most cases. >And this leaves me feeling weird and low for several days. I begin to >wonder if my belief in God is just a game I am playing with myself, a >convenient fiction to conceal the depressing "reality" out there. I >mean belief makes life so much more pleasant that I actually don't >care whether it is "true" or "false". Yet my mind subconsciously tries >to impose order on my thoughts and classify them as true and false. > >The real solution seems to me to avoid these people altogether. But >how is this compatible with loving them? I mean if I ignore them I >begin to feel emotions of pride and superiority. > >Another issue is if my faith is so weak that just a brief conversation >with an atheist brings on a major moral crisis, is that not something >to worry about? > >Still, I think it is true that the company one keeps has a big impact >on one's thoughts. Just being with a person who believes refreshes the >spirit, even if you talk about something completely superficial and >unrelated to God and religion. > >Sorry about rambling. All this was triggered by an event in real life. >And I needed to get this out of my system to try to stop thinking >about it. > >Asim > Perhaps it would help if you said nothing and strengthened you own faith. There is an order to these things that is none of our business. "Every day He is about some task." and "He leads to Himself whom He will." Abraham ------------------------------ From: Sipko den Boer <106254.1277@compuserve.com> Date: Sun, 25 Aug 1996 08:40:42 -0400 Subject: Introduction As salaam aleikum, I am new here I said to the friend. Do you know where it is about? Well tell us something about yourself, he/ she said. But can I trust you people? Only when you have faith.. Music has always been very important to me. It is a very powerful means to express myself and a tool for transformation. As a young man I had problems to sort out my feelings and I dropped all my passions which connected me with the whole. I was able to work thru these existential fears with the help of a specialist who at a certain moment advised me to study outlook on life thru belief or religion. I started to study the Sufism of Inayat Khan who brought a message of spiritual unity through honoring the diversity of the world's religious traditions. Inayat Khan being an accomplished musician has been very inspiring to me in particular with his teachings on the mysticism of sound. In a later stadium of my Sufi studies I longed to travel to the middle east experience/ study classical Sufism and meet people who are involved in the Remembrance of Allah. And I found that healing is the subtantial what is sought in tariqat. Ya shafi Allah! The practice or use of music as a means for spiritual development or spiritual and physical healing is still used extensively within the orders. You could say that music in the east has always been appreciated as a regular medical discipline while in the west the effectiveness is often disputed. In Pakistan and India, the therapeutic effects of Qawwali (Arabic: recitation) gatherings are commonly known. A promonent psychiatrist who works for the Rawalpindi Medical College, who is aware of the effects and who has a profound interest in Qawwali, prescribes Qawwali therapy for some of his patients with demonstrated succes. In Turkey works, Dr. Uruc Guvenc, who is a Sheikh in the Alevi Bektashi and the Mevlevi Order, as a psychotherapist. This modern healer/ musician is studying the technique of forms of music therapy which originates from the shamanistic rites of Central-Asia. During the therapy sessions there is music played on authentic instruments which are handmade by his assistants. Dr Guvenc has travelled in Europe and the U.S. to give lectures. He was invited by Sheikh Kabir Helminski of the Threshold Society and the Mevlevi Order of America to record an album with Illahi's named: Ocean of Remembrance. Here in the Netherlands we hold regular Sama' ( Arabic: listening) meetings for prayer, devotional music, singing and poetry. Finally every form of healing means that we are able to end the illusion of being separated and that we can discover the natural state of our hearts in Love, Harmony and Beauty. May Allah bless you all Ashiq ------------------------------ From: Joshi Date: Sun, 25 Aug 1996 22:17:47 +0800 Subject: Limits as salaamu 'alaikum Shaykh Ibn'Ata'Illah, in Hikam says: "Your desire for isolation, even though God has put you in the world to gain a living, is a hidden passion. And your desire to gain a living in the world, even though God has put you in isolation, is a comedown from a lofty aspiration." "If I should will something that my Lord does not will for me, I should then be guitly of unbelief."-- Rabi'a al Adawiyya. O God, You called, and we were slow. Alas! alas! what we did we did in poor judgement. ------------------------------ From: woodsong@juno.com (Carol Woodsong) Date: Sun, 25 Aug 1996 10:49:37 EDT Subject: Re: Surrender and God's Will Hello Craig, >A flower surrenders its petals, >Which, falling to the ground, >Become the ground, >Which nourishes the flower. all that dies shall be reborn! :) how/why does the flower 'surrender' it's flowerness? certainly not by knowledge of it's destiny the surrender is its willingness to BE... that which it IS? ------------------------------ From: James McCaig Date: Sun, 25 Aug 1996 10:53:39 +0100 Subject: Re: Introduction Dear Brother Ashiq and Sufi Sisters and Brothers, It is a pleasure to have your comments and welcome. There has been some discussion in recent months about music and some within this group have expressed concern that music can actually slow our progress along the spiritual road to conciousness, unless it has been chosen for the seeker by a qualified Sheikh. Would you care to comment on this from your perspective? At 08:40 AM 8/25/96 -0400, you wrote: >Music has always been very important to me. It is a very powerful means to >express myself and a tool for transformation. As a young man I had problems >to sort out my feelings and I dropped all my passions which connected me >with the whole. I was able to work thru these existential fears with the >help of a specialist who at a certain moment advised me to study outlook on >life thru belief or religion. I started to study the Sufism of Inayat Khan >who brought a message of spiritual unity through honoring the diversity of >the world's religious traditions. Inayat Khan being an accomplished >musician has been very inspiring to me in particular with his teachings on >the mysticism of sound. In a later stadium of my Sufi studies I longed to >travel to the middle east experience/ study classical Sufism and meet >people who are involved in the Remembrance of Allah. And I found that >healing is the subtantial what is sought in tariqat. Ya shafi Allah! The >practice or use of music as a means for spiritual development or spiritual >and physical healing is still used extensively within the orders. You >could say that music in the east has always been appreciated as a regular >medical discipline while in the west the effectiveness is often disputed. >In Pakistan and India, the therapeutic effects of Qawwali (Arabic: >recitation) gatherings are commonly known. A promonent psychiatrist who >works for the Rawalpindi Medical College, who is aware of the effects and >who has a profound interest in Qawwali, prescribes Qawwali therapy for some >of his patients with demonstrated succes. >In Turkey works, Dr. Uruc Guvenc, who is a Sheikh in the Alevi Bektashi and >the Mevlevi Order, as a psychotherapist. This modern healer/ musician is >studying the technique of forms of music therapy which originates from the >shamanistic rites of Central-Asia. During the therapy sessions there is >music played on authentic instruments which are handmade by his assistants. >Dr Guvenc has travelled in Europe and the U.S. to give lectures. He was >invited by Sheikh Kabir Helminski of the Threshold Society and the Mevlevi >Order of America to record an album with Illahi's named: Ocean of >Remembrance. This is a fantastic recording and will bring pleasure to any listener. > Warm regards, Maharaj James McCaig | Sufi Center of Washington Brotherhood/Sisterhood Representative | Keepers of Sufi Center Bookstore United States | http://guess.worldweb.net/sufi jmccaig@worldweb.net ------------------------------ From: Michael Moore Date: Sun, 25 Aug 1996 10:29:12 -0700 Subject: Re: Friend of Allah? (fwd) > > as salaamu 'alaikum > Just a little something I would like to share; on my way home today, > I was crossing the street, along with a number of others, and...crossing > from the other direction was a Br; I glanced at him for perhaps a second or > two, but my heart contracted painfuly, and I felt such an elevation, as I > cannot explain; he was not particularly good looking, or well dressed; abt > 5'8, slim, with a long sleeved shirt worn tucked out over baggy pants, a > skull cap, and a beard/goatee on a rather thin face. > I remember as I passed by him, feeling the way Allah[swt] willed me > to feel, that if only more Brs could be like him; sadly enuff, tho I reside > in a country where abt 10% of the population is muslim, few of them reflect > this; brthers especially are famous for tight tight clothes and unislamic > behaviour. But I digress; as soon as I thought " if only more Brs could > dress like this, it makes me so so happy to see a br dress like this" > another thought struck me, namely that I have seen Brs dressed like that, I know a man who dresses sunnah. He kisses the feet of the Grand Shaykh. Then he feeds his drug habit and stands in the street with his fist in the air shouting the most vile obsenities and threats. The best clothes are those that do not frighten people. - -Michael- ------------------------------ From: Craig Johannsen Date: Sun, 25 Aug 1996 12:48:08 -0700 Subject: Re: Surrender and God's Will Hi Carol, You wrote: > > Hello Craig, > > >A flower surrenders its petals, A metaphor for giving up something we believe to be of value, perhaps something we (incorrectly) believe to be our most beautiful and valuable part (nafs?). The petal is not the flower. > >Which, falling to the ground, The place of origin, that which supplies all that we are. > >Become the ground, Returns to its origin. > >Which nourishes the flower. Rebirth (as you already noted). > all that dies shall be reborn! :) > how/why does the flower 'surrender' it's flowerness? > certainly not by knowledge of it's destiny Does it have a choice? Perhaps not. But I imagine that the flower surrenders its petals reluctantly, after having worked so hard to create them. Is it aware of its destiny? Maybe in a "flowery" kind of way it is -- it follows a kind of map or plan that is a part of its own existence. Are we aware of our own destinies? Maybe in a "humanish" kind of way we are -- but do we know our destiny as well as the flower? We sometimes imagine destinies that aren't really there. > the surrender is its willingness to BE... > that which it IS? The surrender is its sacrifice in order to follow the plan and to be part of something much larger which, in the end, is necessary for its existence. Not being is necessary to being. ------------------------------ From: Michael Moore Date: Sun, 25 Aug 1996 13:44:41 -0700 Subject: Re: Friend of Allah? (fwd) Asim Jalis wrote: > > A related issue is that of people who are atheist. I am torn about > whether I should quickly change the subject with them if they bring up > the issue of God or whether to wait and hear out their ideas. I am > more attracted to the first but end up doing the second in most cases. > And this leaves me feeling weird and low for several days. I begin to > wonder if my belief in God is just a game I am playing with myself, a > convenient fiction to conceal the depressing "reality" out there. I > mean belief makes life so much more pleasant that I actually don't > care whether it is "true" or "false". > > Asim You must ask your shaykh. If you do not have one then you must find one. What you are asking here is VERY serious. You are in extreme danger! Please do not underestimate the power of these thoughts to destroy you. I believe that there are several qualified Shayks here, but you must ask for help. You must take bayat giving permission. A shaykh can only give limited help without permission. Please do not delay, this is urgent. If you have difficulty making a connection with a shaykh, contact me and I will give you the phone number of my shaykh. Until you have done this, I strongly suggest that you avoid the atheists. It is wiser to error on the side of caution and where your eternal soul may be at risk, great caution! In the mean time Pray! Go to the mosque as much as possible. Only talk to strong believers. Repeat the shahada as much as possible until it rings like a clear bell who's vibrations drive out the darkness. a-oozu bil-laahi minash-shaitaa-nir rajeem michael ------------------------------ From: woodsong@juno.com (Carol Woodsong) Date: Sun, 25 Aug 1996 19:14:52 EDT Subject: Re: Surrender and God's Will >> >A flower surrenders its petals, > >A metaphor for giving up something we believe >to be of value, perhaps something we (incorrectly) >believe to be our most beautiful and valuable part >(nafs?). The petal is not the flower. yes, the petal is not the essence of the flower. >> >Which, falling to the ground, > >The place of origin, that which supplies all that >we are. yes, my body returns to Earth Mother, but, my essence shall, i believe, return to Father- - or maybe more accurately, the Great Mystery. >> >Become the ground, > >Returns to its origin. > >> >Which nourishes the flower. > >Rebirth (as you already noted). yes... i must 'give up' that which i believe to be my/self/... before i can be reborn. >> all that dies shall be reborn! :) >> how/why does the flower 'surrender' it's flowerness? >> certainly not by knowledge of it's destiny > >Does it have a choice? Perhaps not. But I imagine that isn't this the crux of it! The flower does not have 'choice'... but we do... or so we think! >the flower surrenders its petals reluctantly, after having oh, my flowers are never reluctant! :) The buds open as they are ready... as He WILLS it... and fufill their destiny without knowing the pain of holding on to that which is impermanent. Being, living, becoming, dying, being... never a thought of separation... >worked so hard to create them. Is it aware of its >destiny? Maybe in a "flowery" kind of way it is -- it >follows a kind of map or plan that is a part of its >own existence. Are we aware of our own destinies? >Maybe in a "humanish" kind of way we are -- but do we >know our destiny as well as the flower? We sometimes >imagine destinies that aren't really there. <> the surrender is its willingness to BE... >> that which it IS? > >The surrender is its sacrifice in order to follow the what sacrifice? If I AM that which I AM... there is no thing to sacrifice... yes? Thy Will be mine! >plan and to be part of something much larger which, >in the end, is necessary for its existence. >Not being is necessary to being. < Date: Mon, 26 Aug 1996 07:22:42 -0700 Subject: RUMI 1725 HAVEN'T I TOLD YOU don't run away from me you'll find me like a fountainhead wherever you go in this mirage even if you leave me with anger for a hundred thousand years you'll finally return since i'm your final home haven't i told you don't be fooled with the spangles in life i'm your final fulfillment haven't i told you that i'm the sea and you're a small fish you're better off staying with me than venturing the dry shores haven't i told you don't go towards the trap like a bird enticed by bait come back to me i'm your endless strength haven't i told you others will kill your fire stay with me who will set you on flame and warm your soul haven't i told you others will disillusion you you'll lose the fountainhead of the solace i've found for you if you're enlightened by the lantern of your heart guiding you to God's house look at me i may be the path ghazal number 1725, translated March 1, 1992, by Nader Khalili. tanzen ------------------------------ From: Joshi Date: Mon, 26 Aug 1996 22:32:36 +0800 Subject: Rumi:-) as salaamu 'alaikum Masha'Allah, I am so very very happy today:-) alHamdulillah; I received news from a br that he is sending me some things pertaining to sufism, May he be rewarded for it, and to add to it, I came home today and beheld a gift from a sister, alHamdulillah; two books, one of them, " The Sufi Path of LOve" [by Rumi, translated , I think by William Chittick]; masha'Allah, I am giddy with ...joy; and there is no will or power bu Allah[swt] ; suHanallah:-) "If everything that appears to us were just as it appears, the Prophet[saw] who was endowed with such penetrating vision would never have cried out:"O Lord! show us things as they are!" "In the face of meaning, what is form? Very contemptible. The meaning of the heavens keeps them in place... The meaning of the wind makes it wander like a millwheel, captive to the water of the stream." "Know that the outward form passes away, but the World of Meaning remains forever. How long will you make love with the shape of the jug? Leave aside the jug's shape; Go, seek water! Having seen the form, you are unaware of the meaning. If you are wise, pick out the pearl from the shell." May He bless the sister who has sent me this:-) ameen. wasalaam. "If I should will something that my Lord does not will for me, I should then be guitly of unbelief."-- Rabi'a al Adawiyya. O God, You called, and we were slow. Alas! alas! what we did we did in poor judgement. ------------------------------ From: Sipko den Boer <106254.1277@compuserve.com> Date: Mon, 26 Aug 1996 15:03:40 -0400 Subject: Prayer I will always pray for your welfare What more can I ask from God, my only prayer is for your long life. Because without mt guardian, my true love I am a worthless ugly wretch. I pray and I pray that you might be blessed and spared from every grief. I pray for God to keep watch over you. I pray and I pray for your welfare my love, this is my only prayer. Let me die at your feet, this is my only prayer. What else can I ask from God. Let me carry the burden of your grief, and may God keep you from harm. When I was cut off from your love I felt abandoned by the whole world. Now it fills me with joy, just praying for you. When I found you I discovered the universe. May God bless you all Ashiq ------------------------------ From: malik@uni-muenster.de (Aurangseb Malik) Date: Sun, 25 Aug 96 22:48:25 Subject: Introduction Asalamoaleikum, I just joined this list and want to introduce myself. I have been raised in Islam, but could'nt be satisfied of what i was taught... there have been several reasons for that. When i grew older i turned away from Islam, seeking 'spiritual' knowledge in meditation and yoga. Recently i learned about the sufi people and found their path and wisdom to be very similar to the one taught by the famous yoga teacher Paramahansa Yogananda. Hoping to learn more - with heart and mind. Do you know if there are God-realized teachers in Pakistan? (I guess there are, but where?......) Aorangzeb. - --------------------------------------------------------------------- Aurangseb Malik * Josef Beckmann Str. 9 * 48159 Muenster * Germany Phone ++49+251-218236 * email malik@uni-muenster.de to receive my PGP public key mail me with subject 'keyrequest' - --------------------------------------------------------------------- ^Z ------------------------------ End of tariqas-digest V1 #110 *****************************